Say WHAT?! The Boston Globe reported 2 hours beforehand that a "controlled explosion" would go off in the exact location where 19 year old pot-smoker Tsarnaev is supposed to have detonated the first bomb... things that make you go 'HMMM!...'
Although the gruesome sight of mangled body parts is an everyday reality in countries occupied or bombed by the U.S. military, the 'double-tap' bombing in downtown Boston on 'Tax Day', Monday 15th April, was the first terror attack on U.S. soil in 12 years.

Anyone with a couple of neurons firing will have noticed by now that the official story is riddled with inconsistencies. In fact, it makes absolutely no sense at all. In fact, there is no 'official story'; U.S. authorities have clearly just been making stuff up as they go along, hoping that the emotional trauma of a terrorist attack will suffice to 'win the hearts and minds of the American people'.

So far it appears to be working, but when we discussed this on a recent SOTT Talk Radio show, we had a few callers who were completely exasperated with the contradictory, incomplete, and simply unbelievable accounts of last week's events in Boston.

It was a strange week in more ways than one. It was the 20th anniversary of the Waco Massacre. It was the 18th anniversary of the Oklahoma City Bombing. It was the 14th anniversary of the Columbine School Massacre. And the bombings happened on the 238th anniversary of the opening shots in the American Revolutionary War.

Coincidences? Or by design?

And what on Earth careened into the town of West, Texas, just north of Waco and within miles of the Mount Carmel site of the Branch Davidian compound that was burned to the ground by the Feds in 1992? The explosion at a fertilizer depot on Wednesday 18th April killed three times as many people as the Boston Bombings just two days before... was someone sending the bombing perpetrators a message?

Listen to find out more...

Running Time: 02:35:00

Download: MP3

Here's the transcript:

Niall: Hello and welcome to all our listeners. This is SOTT talk radio. Tonight we have Jason Martin. And my co-host Joe Quinn.

Joe: Hey, How's it going.

Niall: Alright, so it has been quite an eventful week with the Boston marathon bombings. It's strange you know. 'Terror, terror, terror,' that's all we have heard since 9/11, but actually that was the first terrorist attack since that day, so that's 11 years.

Joe: On American soil, so to speak.

Niall: Yeah, the first real one since then.

Joe: Yeah, and they've certainly played it up in the media, hyped it to an extreme level about it being the first terror attack and I mean I've been watching quite a few mainstream media reports and just the way that the anchors talk about the actual the bombing and the way they 2portray it you know. There's no essence of "secure beneath the watchful eyes" and "y'all can sleep better tonight". "You all can sleep safe tonight now that our authorities have taken care of the situation." Anchors have been saying some really cheesy, crass stuff like that you know.

That really makes you cringe. And plays it up when in fact, given the state of the world today it's a fairly, it was a relatively small event. It was terrible because it was Americans. There's a sense that it was more terrible because it was a bombing in America than everywhere else.

Jason: Well everyone knows that white life is more important brown life.

Joe: Yeah but...

Jason: That's the American philosophy you know.

Niall: Oh but it isn't, right? One God. One nation equal under God.

Jason: Have you ever met a white person? Have you ever met white people in general? I mean white Americans and middle class Americans? They are just... they are terrible.

Joe: They're sanctimonious.

Jason: There's like this whole thing like you know millions of people die constantly from things that are preventable and yet nobody sheds a tear, unless of course they're white and middle class.

Joe: Mm-hm.

Jason: And killed in suspicious circumstances. You know and circumstances that normally you wouldn't, you normally when your walking down the streets of Boston you don't think about encountering some sort of anti-personnel bomb.

Joe: Yeah, exactly. So it's the shock value. It's the way Americans have been kind of sheltered and isolated from any idea - it's always "It's over there" and "It's us doing it to them because we're the good guys, there the bad guys. Never happens here. Should never happen here. If it happens here, it's an outrage. It's a travesty. Just shouldn't happen to Americans and that what, that's why it's hyped up.

Jason: Well, that's the whole thing it shouldn't happen to white Americans type of thing. Because you've got to remember like the U.S. is not that safe and not all that good.

The poorer communities of America deal with violent deaths and various different things, shootings, drive bys, "the drug war" quote unquote. The war on drugs.

So I mean like again you know this whole thing about like "this doesn't happen in America" is like yeah, normally bombs don't go off in America, but lots of people die for reasons that they shouldn't.

Joe: Yeah there's lots of senseless death.

Jason: There's lots of senseless death in America.

Joe: And indiscriminate.

Jason: Yeah it's indiscriminately.

Joe: So we're dealing with the same case here in the Boston Marathon bombings. What is the difference then? It must be the way it was portrayed in the media, because if the media portrayed other indiscriminate killings in the U.S. that happen pretty much every day, in the same way - well they couldn't really I suppose because they could if they, if they had a track record of doing it. But they don't have a track record of doing it. They just don't report on it. Four or five people get shot in a drive by shooting or something like that, that's more people than were killed in the Boston bombing.

But it's not hyped up. It's not an affront to our democratic values. It's just life in America. But the Boston bombing is an affront to our democratic values and it's an attack on every American.

Jason: Well, it's a very auspicious place for it to take place. I was talking to Niall at one point that the Northeast of America is kind of like the rich America. It's the original colonies type of thing. It's sort of the seat of rich, upper middle class Republicanism, or what passes for it these days. And so it was a very interesting place for them to chose for this.

Joe: Striking at the heart at white America. White sanctimonious America.

Jason: White, sanctimonious, self-righteous, voting America mainly.

Joe: Yeah, believers.

Jason: Yeah, the true believers in the government.

Niall: American dream and the government.

Jason: Oh yeah the people who benefit from it in a certain sense are factory owners that...

Niall: That something that we'll want to bring up, the location. Boston - I was looking at all these things happening this week on the anniversary of this or that. Ok, we had the 20th anniversary of the Waco massacre, 18th anniversary of the Oklahoma City bombing. But going way back in history, the Boston bombing happened the same day, the 15th, that the opening shots in the American Revolutionary War were fired. Not far from Boston I believe..

Jason: I don't know.

Niall: Concord.

Jason: You're talking to an American here. You're asking me about a question about history and geography at the same time. Are you insane?

Niall: It was the original colonies.

Jason: It was one of those states.

Niall: It just got me thinking about that. Although it has all been wrapped up now, you know America is once again 'safe under the watchful eyes'. When we scheduled this show there was - it was like everything was in suspense. They had not wheeled out the Osama Bin next. They had not gone too overboard, I didn't think. There was a three day period where they had no leads. They had arrested someone, but released him, no charges made. And I was thinking what's going on here? Are they going to blame it on homegrown white patriot crazy people? Or will it be once again dirty foreign Muslims?

Jason: Well, I mean the key there is foreign. Foreigners, Muslims - specifically - it's always going to be foreigners. Or you know, gun nuts. Foreigners, gun nuts, conspiracy theorists, sort of the usual suspects there that they've created. They just sort of have - I think they actually have a computer program. Kind of like you know the L. Ron Hubbard one that wrote that Battlefield Earth thing. They have like a computer program where it's got graphic icons that like "Lets pick a terrorist attack" and then they like pick a random location and then they have these big icons of. like really sort of stereotypical like "gun nut", "Muslim", "immigrant". And they sort of pick it, like it's out of idiocracy or something. It generates a fake terror attack.

Niall: That may not be far from the truth. I mean Al-Qaeda was the Database...

Joe: Yeah.

Niall: ...of expendable patsies, right?

Jason: Right, yeah.

Joe: Yeah

Niall: As we'll see, these two brothers were not just any old random - they have a history. A history with the FBI. A history with alleged links to radical Islam. In other words they have a kind of a created history.

Joe: Mm-hm.

Niall: So obviously we will be talking about the Boston bombings. That's another thing. Friday. What the hell happened in Boston? Because if that wasn't martial law, I don't know what is.

Joe: Yeah

Niall: The whole city locked down...

Joe: Mm-hm.

Niall: in you can't leave your home. And people obeyed it in their hundreds of thousands. We're starting to see some people have managed to get video footage up on YouTube of houses being raided. People being marched out one-by-one, hands in the air, "put your hands up!". You know, totally confused. Don't know what's going on.

Joe: Well, if there is anyone in Boston listening...

Niall: Yeah.

Joe: ... we'd appreciate a call in to see if you can verify that. We've just seen one video of a guy in the area, I think in a Watertown, right?

Niall: Yeah, a suburb.

Joe: Watertown area of Boston, who that was filming from his house, filming another house with these jackbooted thugs coming in, banging on the door. Eventually someone opened the door. They all march in and then a stream of people eventually one after the other - they found them in the house, people, men and women, were forced out, hands in the air. We don't know if that was - what I did find a bit strange about it was that it was almost like a clown house, you know like a clown car, but it was a clown house. Because these people just kept coming out. There must of been about eight of them in total.

Niall: Yeah I wondered.

Joe: There was at least one woman that came out, but they were all - most of them were adult males. And they just, every thirty seconds another one would come out with their hands in the air. And it was presented on YouTube by the guy who filmed it as "this was a warrantless search. This was not - people hadn't agreed to this kind of a search you know what I mean? It wasn't people saying "Yeah come in jackbooted thugs have look around my house". So I don't know if that happened in a lot of houses or whether they more polite with other houses. Maybe that was a drug house or something like that, who knows?

Jason: I don't know?

Joe: But probably not in Boston, not the area of Boston. It's all pretty affluent.

Jason: The days warrants are quickly going away. Not slowly, quickly. You know the days of warrants and. legal search and seizure.

Joe: Well, they're gone already

Jason: Pretty much gone, you know.

Joe: Yeah, so but people welcomed it with open arms really I think.

Jason: Because it wasn't hurting or happening to them. I mean the type of people who that accept that type of stuff, it's because in a certain sense they probably don't have anything in their lives that any other person would be interested in. Like, for good or bad. So they don't care. No one is ever going to raid their house and kill them because they're not worth anything.

Joe: They're not doing anything worthy of that. They're living...

Jason: Their not a communist, homosexual or something like that, so you know...

Joe: They're living...

Jason: They're living completely mediocre...

Joe: Middle class lives of quiet desperation.

Niall: Yeah, this was like terror-entertainment. Something happened. Cool, dude check this out!

Joe: All of them came out afterwards. There were - I don't know if you are aware of this Jason, but they were marching - they all came out and paraded in the streets cheering, shouting "USA, USA".

Jason: The thing is, it's going to be a utopia for those people. Truly and completely for those people it will be - an absolute totalitarian state will be a utopia because it will be like every once in a while the government will need to bring out a terrorist attack so that it will kill a couple of them. But from their perspective it's a small sacrifice. Small price to pay, you know.

Niall: It does seem that way.

Joe: For a certain percentage - it's probably pretty well split down the middle. Maybe not split down the middle, but it's divided up into certain sections where you have these groups of fanatics who are just like "oh my god!" They're ecstatic at the - just the idea that the police are...

Niall: Are paying attention to them.

Joe: Well, that they're after a terrorist suspect in their neighborhood and they get the whole kick out of being afraid. Hunker down, afraid, stay in your house. And then it is like "Yay we got them". Then they are out in the streets banging on cop cars and shaking swat team members hands.

Jason: Sports fans. It's the same concept as the sports fan.

Joe: Well actually the video of it was exactly like the videos you see of people whose team has won a major competition or something. They're out...

Jason: American team, you know.

Joe: Yeah, and it was scary and I'm sure there a lot of people that were a bit disturbed by the whole thing.

Jason: Yeah, but I mean they are not going to say anything.

Joe: Aren't going to do back flips afterwards. You know what I mean?

Niall: But if you were in the area, call us. Send us a comment. Let us know.

Joe: Yeah.

Niall: Share your thoughts.

Joe: If you know anybody in the area or if you have any reports. You don't necessarily have to live there. If you simply know someone, have a friend, or a family or whatever, who has any on-the-ground information, we'd appreciate it. But what really struck me was in seeing those images of the people whooping and cheering, at essentially the death of the - the murder of more or less, the murder of two people in their neighborhood. Yeah and actually they haven't presented any evidence that they guilty.

Jason: And they never will.

Joe: One of them is dead and the other one is soon to be. So...

Jason: Hang himself in his cell or something stupid like that.

Joe: Yeah, so those people whooping it up, loving it, it was really striking. I don't know if many Americans are aware of that. Certainly those people aren't aware of it, but a very similar event happened in France last year, which was the Muhammed Murat incident where supposedly this young, interestingly enough, supposedly around the same age, 21 years old, French guy of Algerian extraction, but he was French, was accused of shooting dead three soldiers and then three other members of at a Jewish school in Toulouse.

Niall: Yeah, in Toulouse.

Joe: And there was a hunt for him that lasted most of a week and eventually he was cornered in his flat and it was all over the news for the whole week. And he was cornered in his flat and there was a shoot out very similar to what we're hearing about these Boston guys, the Chechen brothers. And he died in a hail of bullets. There was a lot of suspicious and unbelievable aspects to that story as well. But what was interesting was that there was no fanfare afterwards. Maybe it is just an aspect of French people. But there was no parades in the streets of the people...

Jason: The problem is as I recall he was killed in an area that was very predominantly Muslim.

Joe: I don't know, but you would think this was all over Boston they, were out in the streets. So there just wasn't the same sense of - and it's quite particular to Americans where they would, any number of Americans would have that kind of reaction, in terms of psychology of the real blue0-blooded, red blooded American.

Jason: I don't think that the French - the French are a little bit too joyless to go out in the streets and celebrate. They kind of have no soul. Whereas the Americans, they're mean-spirited, but the second part of mean spirited is still having a spirit.

Joe: Yeah, but in this case it is not exactly a positive...

Jason: Oh no, no. It is certainly not positive.

Joe: ... example of it. Yeah. Anyway, getting into the story, as most people listening are probably aware there were two bombings. Two bombs went off pretty much at the end of the Boston marathon on Monday. Killed three people. Injured over 100, 160 maybe. It's quite high in terms of injuries, but there are various types of injuries.

Niall: Yeah.

Joe: And a for a couple of days there were no real definite leads. A couple of Saudis were implicated and they were...

Jason: De-implicated

Joe: They were de-implicated and one of them flew home. And then suddenly two Chechen brothers, 19 years old and 26 years old, one of them born and naturalized an American, the other one with a green card. Same situation as almost every other terror-type plot or attack. The family members of the accused and the friends of the accused just couldn't believe it. How could they ever do that? There's no way I would ever thought that that guy would ever do that same kind of thing. People just amazed, and even the guys themselves showing, especially the younger brother, showing an amazing ability to be cool under pressure. He is only 19 years old and after the bombing, because it was on Monday and it wasn't until Thursday really that they went after them. So in those intervening days he back to his classes at college, at the University of Massachusetts. And there's reports of his classmates and stuff saying "Yeah, he's just totally cool. He went out drinking with some people. He was totally cool and had made no reference to it whatsoever".

Jason: Didn't I hear a similar thing with Harvey Oswald? Didn't he go to a theater afterward or something?

Niall: I think Lee Harvey Oswald was on the run.

Jason: Was he right afterward?

Niall: Yeah.

Joe: I think it's cause he realized he might be set up and double-crossed.

Niall: It looked like these guys...

Joe: But he did go to a cinema. Lee Harvey Oswald went to a cinema.

Jason: To hide maybe.

Joe: He may of been duck and dive. Or maybe not you know.

Jason: Well, we just watched that Oklahoma City bombing thing, remember? And I remember at the end of it I kind of got the feeling that Timothy McVeigh was definitely set up, but it couldn't have happened to a better douche bag so...

Joe: Yeah.

Jason: And this is the same kind of - if they were working with the FBI, I grew up in West Florida during the '90s you know, with Tupac. I mean to me, if someone is working for the FBI and they get setup by the FBI, I mean it is poetic justice you know.

Joe: Yeah, well it may not be as clear cut as that because there are people that work for the FBI - the way it has worked with these previous terror plots, and there have literally been dozen of them in the past ten years, dozens of foiled terror plots, that any of them could have ended in the same way the Boston marathon one did. The Boston marathon simply was different in the sense that a bomb actually went off. But all of these other terror plots involved usually young or young and/or intellectually challenged, poor very often black or foreign, of foreign extraction, U.S. nationals, who had been contacted by, not the FBI themselves, but an FBI informant. This is another guy 0- this is the real douche bag in this situation. The ones who do jail time, they're the dupes. They can be douche bags as well, but the real douche bag is the guy in the middle who is working for the FBI. He's often like a petty criminal who's given time off for working for the FBI...

Jason: For being a snitch.

Joe: Yeah for being a snitch and he goes and he contacts these guys under the pretenses that he is whatever, Al Qaeda just whatever they want to do, whatever the patsies are into. He kind of tells them that he is into that to and he's doing it for money. So he wants to get a conviction out these guys. He wants to frame these guys for the FBI, because the FBI is paying him to do it.

Jason: Right.

Joe: So he's motivated to do it. And that's what's happened in virtual every single one in the past. And the context is all important. I think for the people to understand this, to get a general understanding and a truthful understanding of the Boston bombings, they need to understand the context of all of these previous terror plots. I'll just give you a rundown of a few of them over the past few years. But as I said there have been dozens and they've all been carbon copies of each other, except for the finer detail?

In 2006 a guy called Derrick Shareef, was 22 and desperate for cash to fix his car, was approached by an informant at a video game store. And the informant was a career criminal and he offered Shareef a vehicle, a place to live and free meals at his house. And it was the day before Ramadan and Shareef, who had been on the outs with his family since converting to Islam at age 15, saw the offer as an act of god. Shareef literally told the informant that he wanted to attack a courthouse and smoke a judge. The informant suggested attacking a shopping mall instead at Christmas. Shareef excitedly agreed since he was still broke. And he traded with an arms dealer a set of his speakers for some grenades and a 9 mm handgun. The arms dealer was an FBI informant so as soon as they traded and they got some recordings of him saying "Yeah, shopping mall Christmas? Yeah, just keep the money coming." The FBI swoops in and boom, 35 years in jail for attempted use of weapons of mass destruction, a grenade.

Then in 2005 Tarik Shah who's an accomplished jazz bassist... He actually played at Bill Clintons inauguration. He was a martial arts studio owner. He met FBI informant Mohamed Alanssi through an Islamic bookstore in New York City. For two years Alanssi kept in contact with Shah, but got nothing incriminating on him. So the FBI turned to a second informant, Theodore Shelby, who is an ex-convict and former Black Panther. He recorded conversations that show Shah as a man obsessed with his martial arts products and had a desire to train Muslims in martial arts. In one exchange Shah talked about how he could used the sharp pin that his double bass rested on, to kill someone. And there is a direct quote of what he said here. He kind of told the FBI informant. He said, pointing to his double bass pin at the bottom, saying "All I've got to do is pop flick, like boom and then its like move it out of the way". He said "Look. Flip, pop, bing right in the middle of your head." Eventually Shelby introduced him, this is the FBI informant, introduced him to an Arabic speaking FBI agent who led Shah and a friend in an oath to Al Qaeda. And the oath became a key piece evidence in his conviction. He got 15 years for conspiring to provide material support to terrorists.

Jason: This is me crying.

Joe: I could go on, you know. There's so many of these and they are all exactly the same.

Niall: There are also instances where there are groups of guys, maybe loosely know each other. Maybe there friends.

Joe: Yeah, well there was one in 2011, a couple years ago the Newburgh Four. Sorry 2009. The Newburgh Four. These were four guys who were arrested for an alleged plot to blow up a synagogue and a military aircraft. They were all poor black Americans and at least one was mentally unstable. He actually stored his urine in jars at his apartment.

Niall: Oh boy.

Joe: The fifth member of the team was actually - surprise, surprise - an FBI informant who promised them food and hundreds of thousands of dollars to carry out the plot. Even the federal judge hearing this case said that the government created acts of terrorisms out of the defendant's fantasies of bravado and bigotry and then made those fantasies come true. The government did not have to infiltrate and foil some nefarious plot, because there was no nefarious plot to foil.

Niall: Ok what was the sentence?

Joe: Those guys all got sentenced to somewhere between 15 and 25 years.

Niall: In spite of the judge...

Joe: In spite of the judge saying that.

Niall: Oh my god.

Joe: And they've gone through the whole list you know there has been Moroccans, Yemenis...

Niall: And not just Muslims and war on terror.

Joe: No well they've always tried pick them as Muslims type of thing with some... they try to get them to have some kind of Muslim affiliation. They may not be religious Muslims, but they may have some kind of with the 'brothers'. It's almost like the modern day black panther type of thing with the brothers now Muslims who are being oppressed by the evil U.S.. And these people are of some Middle Eastern or Pakistani, or that area, extraction and that's - they identify. But they are all intellectually challenged. These are all poor people who basically don't have the wherewithal to kind of...

Jason: They pick those guys on purpose, so that eventually when they come up with somebody who they're actually just pinning something on out of whole cloth who isn't a retard and greedy, then people would be more likely to believe it because of this other chain you know.

Joe: Yeah, I mean there's one that I wrote an article on. It really was an egregious one called the Miami terror cell about the Liberty City Seven. That was back in 2006. And this was a pretty deranged group of five. And this is their own definition of themselves: they were Christian Zionist Muslim martial artists. (laughter) And they called themselves the Sea of David, because they were also - they were quietly living in a warehouse in Florida awaiting the fulfillment of biblical end times prophecy when one day an undercover FBI agent came along and offered them 50 grand, initiated them into Al Qaeda with an oath of swearing, provided them with military boots and a video camera and suggested that they wanted to blow up certain government building and the Sears tower in Chicago.

The leader of this group, this group of unlikely terrorists, his name is Narseal Batiste, according to his father needs psychiatric help and has done for a long time and even justice department officials acknowledge the group did not have the means to carry out any kind of terror plan. But they went ahead and unveiled the arrests with an orchestrated series of news conferences in two cities. But the severity of the charges compared with the seemingly amateurish nature of the group raised concerns among civil libertarians who noted that the group had no weapons, no explosives and yet the government considers the arrests a case of a major announcement. The government actually claimed that these guys were planning to wage a full scale ground war on America. They actually said that. With their new boots. Planning to wage full ground war against the United States.

Jason: What does that even mean? What the hell does that even mean, full ground war? What is that, what is that bullshit?

Joe: I mean that get away with that, but they convicted them all and they all went to jail for like somewhere between - the leader, the guy that needs psychiatric help, got like 70 years or something like that. There's been so many others you know, there's Portland Christmas tree car bomber. He was in 2010. His name was Mohamed Osman Mohamud. He's a teenager. He was 19. He bragged to undercover agents that he could get a gun, because he was a rapper, but they provided him with a car bomb, what they said was a car bomb. Just got him to get into it, drive it, park it besides the Christmas tree and get out and then swoop, and then that was it. And there's also of course the underwear bomber. That one, the infamous underwear bomber that one was - but the impression you get from all this is that the FBI has developed into basically "patsies are us".

Jason: Right. Not even good ones.

Joe: They can provide them wholesale to any U.S. intel agency that wants to carry out some kind of an operation.

Jason: Not like even interesting patsies. Basically what they do is they go and find some 19 year old kid who thinks he's a rapper, which automatically is in my mind then right. They say "Look we'll give you 50,000 bucks to drive this car and park it over there by that tree". The truck happens to have a bomb in it - boom instant patsy. I mean come on.

Joe: Yeah but then all of these cases so far there's been no boom. Its all been duping the guy into thinking that this was going to happen. And behind it all is money. He's like "Yeah just keep the money flowing and I'll do whatever you want". You know "We're willing to offer you 50 grand if you could find it within yourself to want to be a member of Al Qaeda. Uhhhhh, yeah!

Jason: The shit is Arlington Road. This is Sesame Street type shit.

Joe: Sesame Street version of Arlington Road, yeah.

Jason: Sesame Street version of Arlington Road.

Joe: But I can just hear the conversation, in the intel agencies that organize this. It's like you've got one agent comes along and comes to whoever organizes the patsies, is probably some dedicated team - kind of handling the patsies, so the other branch comes in and says "Listen, we need a couple of patsies here. What can you do for me?" And the guy is like "Well let me have a look in my book here. I've got - can be a couple of Somalis. I've got Yemenis, Pakistanis. What are you after? What are you looking for?" And the guy's like "Well, no, dead Somalis, Yemenis, the underwear bomber, he was a Yemeni. No we can't do that again. And they're all black. I don't know. Have you got anything else?" And he says "Well, let me see here. Well, I could do you a couple of nationalized American Chechen brothers. How does that sound?" He says, "Hmm, Chechens. That's like - oh, that's good."

Niall: And they're Muslims too.

Joe: We haven't touched that one yet. You've got the whiteys ...

Jason: Chechnya, Lebanon.

Joe: "Got the whiteyness and he's got the Musliminess going on there. That's a good one. Don't know why - yeah, hook me up. Where can I get ahold of these guys?" And it's boom, "Here you go. Here's their information" and the plan's set in motion.

Jason: Probably what they did to these guys is they just basically gave them some grenades and said "Hey this is for a future thing." They went and did the whole bombing and then blamed it on them, and that's where these guys were like "Oh shit, we're patsies all of a sudden" and then went on the run type of thing.

Niall: Actually what I think happened here, I think they appealed to their intelligence because it does sound like they had some brains between them, the two brothers. There is another angle they play up, when they set up people. And that is to actually play on their patriotic feelings and to say that "We need your help. This is a case where we want to test the strength of our enforcements response to an real emergency. Can you make sure you're on that street corner wearing this backpack. And oh, put the black cap on. We need you both there at "X" time and that's it. Just walk away then". And a number of times people are set up that way. It reminds me of the London 7/7 bombings. It has since emerged that they thought they were taking part in a terror drill. It was four guys, I think, and they went into London, met up at a certain place, and then went to the various sites where bombs went off so that they would be there in position. I don't think they had been duped into being members of Al Qaeda and all that. Just the opposite; they were actually doing their patriotic duty.

Joe: Yeah. Well there's the patriotic aspects of it, but that's fairly benign in the sense of they set up these drills, terrorism drills or whatever. People are convinced that there's a threat to the country, a nebulous threat, ill-defined threat to the country from some kind of terrorism where security personnel need to be well-trained in it. So a major event, for example, would be an attack by the terrorists, so let's say we organize a drill at the Boston Marathon. So we get all the police forces and whoever else are involved. They want to test it. So what we need is somebody to act as the bombers, or at least a couple of guys that can act suspiciously, carry backpacks, drop them at a certain place, just to see if the police and whoever else are there who are meant to be looking for these kind of things, would pick up on it. And then we've got a good test of whether it works or not.

Jason: inaudible

Joe: It's up to your imagination basically, the ways that they could do it. But there's also the angle of they have access to people, again, petty criminals and that kind of thing, who may have - they're on their third strike or whatever and they're going down for a long time and it's - they can basically say "Listen, you work for us" and then they can get them to do whatever they want. It could be simply a matter of saying "Listen, we have something that we want you to do for us and we want you to be in a certain place at a certain time. So be there." And that's it. All they need is a body. And then they have to set up in advance, just take video footage. They put them in a certain place where there's surveillance cameras and stuff. And wear a backpack, or "Here's something I want you to deliver to someone. Put it in a backpack and take it down there. He'll know who you are. Or leave it there for him. He's waiting for you to leave the backpack in that certain place."

Jason: Yeah.

Joe: "It's just a drop off. You're doing a drop off for the FBI. It's a sensitive operation. We need somebody of your status ..."

Jason: Calibre.

Joe: ... calibre to carry this out."

Jason: Yeah. People imagine that there has to be some sort of really grand conspiracy to pull something like this off. But it really probably only takes about two-to-three people inside of the FBI or the CIA or something like that; one person to have access to some records, to find where they can get their stool pigeon, fixes up a backpack, says "Be there on this corner. Take this backpack. Drop it off in front of the door." And then he just pushes the button. And there, you've got a terrorist attack from two people. There's no need for a giant conspiracy.

Niall: I suspect that there are more than just a couple of people involved. But there are probably only a couple who know that this time whatever check is normally in place, to make sure it is just a crappy foiled - another terror plot, sort of take their foot off this pedal and 'oop', lets it through. So there are still the same kinds of numbers involved but most of them, as far as they're concerned, it's just going to be another practice run or another foiled terror plot that they'll benefit from. The ones who actually know this time it's going live, it's probably just a couple of people, say.

Jason: I'm beginning to think that it's a very small number of people who really know that it's fake. I think that there's a large number of people who get the heads-up that something might go down and so they're ready to jump on it, but I don't think they have the information that they're faking terrorism. I think that a lot of these politicals, the police commissioner and stuff like that, that they're all sort of being gamed just as much as the patsies. They're being gamed just as much as everybody else. And I think it's probably a small number of people, inside the government, who are really actively pushing it, behind the Sandy Hook type of stuff and in the French government behind the Murat type of thing. I think it's a small number of people. I' not saying that that makes governments in any way innocent or less bad. In fact it probably makes them even a little bit worse, in my opinion. But for other people who might think that I'm saying that 'oh, it's just a couple of bad people', it's a couple of bad people in the midst of a giant pool of sewage, which is the political environment. And just because Obama isn't in there in the drawing room planning the terror attacks himself is not in any way making him smelling like a rose from all the other shit that he does. But I doubt that Obama's like 'oh, we need a fake terrorist attack'.

Joe: Well he doesn't have the security clearance to - he's just a puppet.

Jason: Yeah, he probably doesn't have the security clearance.

Joe: He doesn't run the government. He's just a figurehead, a puppet.

Jason: Well 90 percent of the people in the government are puppets.

Joe: Yeah, exactly.

Niall: All of this begs the question 'Did the FBI have a file on these guys?' Yes they did! They're not just two random people who happened to hate America and do something about their hate. No, they were known. They were interviewed on more than on occasion.

Jason: Probably on the payroll.

Joe: Yeah, absolutely. There's - she may be a bit biased, but there is the statement of his mother.
[MOTHER]: He is really, really properly raised. And in our house never - nobody talks about the terrorism. And my son Tamerlan really was a - got involved in the religion of a religious politics five years ago. So he thought that following his own religious aspects and he never, he never told me that he would be like on the side of Jihad. And whatever they are talking, whatever is talking about him being a loser, didn't see himself the loser. My son would never do this. My son is set up. He was controlled by FBI like for five - three, five years. They knew what my son was doing. They knew what actions and what the site on internet he was going. They used to come home, they used to come and talk to me. They used to tell me that, you know, that they are counseling him. They were telling me that he's really a fearless leader and they're afraid of him. They said - they told me that whatever he is, whatever country decides, or whatever is there, whatever information he's getting, they are counseling him. So how could this happen? How could they - they were counseling every step of him and they are telling today that this is a terrorist act. Never, ever. This is not true. My two sons are innocent. But they were talking to my son and they called me officially and they told me that my son is an excellent boy and they have no problem with that. With him. So at the same time they were telling that he's like - he's is getting information in really extremely - extremely, what is that, site? So they were kind of very, very afraid of him.

[INTERVIEWER]: Could you foresee ...

[MOTHER]: So that's why I think that it is a set-up.

[INTERVIWER]: Could you foresee any chance at all that maybe - and I know this must be very hard to take in as a parent, especially as the mother of your two sons...

[MOTHER]: Yeah.

[INTERVIEWER]: But there could have been a side to them that maybe you just didn't know, that they didn't let you in on.

[MOTHER]: My sons - my oldest son who used to tell me everything, everything. Every day, every second day, my son used to call me and ask me "How are you mamma?" Both of them. "Mamma, we love you." "Mamma, who are you? We miss you." It's impossible, impossible for them - for both of them to do such things. So I am really, really, really, really telling that this is a set-up. My son would tell me, my son never would keep it in secret. So would know whoever would be, you know, knowing - if there is anyone who would know, it would be me, mother. He would never hide it from me. He would tell me that, but never, ever, ever even a word.

[INTERVIEWER]: So your youngest son, as we know at length, is on the run tonight. Boston is locked down. The police are looking for him. If by any chance he's got RT on, if by any chance he gets to hear you speak to him now, what would you say to him?

[MOTHER]: I would say - what would I say? I would say "Save your right and tell them the truth, that you haven't done anything". That this is a set-up.
Joe: "That this is a set-up." Well his mother seems to be pretty well up on the whole ...

Jason: It's a set-up.

Niall: The poor woman.

Joe: I know, yeah. And here's the thing. I've been harassed on facebook. You know that?

Jason: I didn't know that.

Joe: Do you ever get harassed on facebook?

Jason: I don't use facebook at all.

Niall: Jay, you don't know what you're missing.

Jason: It's where you get harassed.

Joe: (inaudible) harassment on facebook if you really try.

Jason: I do.

Joe: Well that's why you don't use it.

Jason: Yeah.

Joe: So because I haven't said it explicitly, but to be honest, in the context that we're presenting here, the three people who were killed and the people who were maimed at the bombing, deserve a lot of sympathy. But those two guys, if what we suspect is the truth, which is that they were set up, they were manipulated and then they were used and killed, they deserve, in my opinion, maybe even more sympathy, simply for the fact that many people in the U.S. are either happy about or cheering, or dancing on their graves, basically. Whereas no one's dancing on the graves of the people who died in the bombing. And the people who died in the bombing were kind of indiscriminate victims, in a way. There was no intent to kill those specific people, whereas there was a deliberate intent to kill these two guys. They were targeted and murdered specifically.

Jason: Right.

Joe: And then their deaths were cheered by the entire nation.

Niall: They were lynched.

Joe: So in the sense of having sympathy for someone, my sympathy extends as much to them.

Jason: Absolutely. I have kind of I guess a weird perspective on a certain thing. I understand - like I believe in the death penalty and things - I agree with those things. I think that there are certain instances where somebody's got to die, you know? If someone say "Hey, today we're going to execute Ted Bundy", I'd be like "Well it's probably a good idea". And if these guys really were terrorists, just imagining for a second that I didn't think that it was all set up, and they really had done what they'd done, then I would say "Okay, yeah. If you're going to go around setting landmines for regular pedestrians, yeah, you need to die".

Joe: Yeah.

Jason: But I would never cheer someone's death. Especially by execution.

Niall: It's not something you take lightly.

Jason: It's not something you take lightly. It doesn't matter. Even if Hitler's dying I'd be like "Okay, look I understand you're going to execute Hitler and I think that that's the correct thing to do and I support that action". But I' not going to go to a party and go "Yeah, Hitler's dead!! Fuck yeah!!" That's uncouth behaviour. That's uncivilised behaviour in my opinion. And so I do have sympathy even for criminals. I think that there's not enough sympathy in the world for criminals. People look at criminals as "Well they're a criminal so therefore they no longer have rights." And I simply don't hold with that. I don't believe that. I don' care what they did. There's no way for you to be excluded from humanity. It doesn't happen. There's some people "Oh, he's a monster." No! You're a human being, okay? You do bad stuff and human beings can do bad things and sometimes it necessitates handling that situation by killing them or something like that. That happens. But you can't ever be excluded from humanity, no matter what you do. I don't care if you kill five billion people. You're still a human being. You still should be subject to laws and subject to ...

Niall: Due process.

Jason: ... the judgment and due process of the people, that you have that right. And no cruel and unusual punishments. Nothing like that. You decide - the judge and the people and a jury says "Okay, we've decided that this person has to die and they can't live in society anymore." You do it with honour, in a certain sense. And people who cheered and jeered and set up a party for that, those people are disgusting.

Joe: At the least uncivilised.

Niall: Well I wonder ...

Jason: But that also doesn't exclude them from humanity unfortunately.

Niall: We talked a few shows back about due process and effectively its removal.

Jason: Right.

Niall: From the Constitution - well from the American way of life? No, it was the NDAA [National Defense Authorization Act of 2013] which effectively removes the right to due process for American citizens. I wonder - this is like the next step. These two guys - okay, it's easy to cast them as foreigners or immigrants when it suits them. But I was thinking about it. They're as American as American can be. They moved to the country. They loved the place. They loved the way of life. They went there because they couldn't get a half decent life back in Chechnya, not surprisingly. And so there they are, they're living the good life, or so they believed of course, and they're as American as can be. Most Americans are from somewhere else. What is America but a country of immigrants? They're one of you.

Jason: That kind of argument is just - it's so mindboggling to me because they talk about American rights and it's like screw American rights, man, it's a human right. And my opinion, the American Constitution should apply to everybody. If it were - the American Bill of Rights and stuff like that. Those are supposed to be human rights. It doesn't matter who you are or where you're from. If you're an American, you're supposed to. This is the ideal - idealised version of what an American does. An American treats everybody like an American. You have the right to say what you want. You have the right to free association, all these different things. And those apply to everyone because everyone's an American. Because as an American that's' your philosophy. The whole idea that there are other countries, really we don't get it. Every country - it's kind of like that thing from Full Metal Jacket, 'inside of everybody is an American just waiting to get out' type of thing.

Joe: We've got a call here. Let's see who we have on the line. Hi caller. What's your name and where are you calling from?

Corey: Hello. Hi this is Corey. I'm calling from the Midwest, here in America.

Jason: Hey Corey, what's up?

Corey: Not much. I just wanted to call and say thank you for maintaining a voice of sanity during this crazy lynching that's going on right now. It's really beyond me how basically what happens, it looks like these FBI informants just kind of go through their email RSS feeds and look up and see who has been looking at the wrong websites and then they go track them down, take them out, and then just go ahead and set up a public lynching with the main distinction that nowadays that rather than we cheer on the slavery of others, we are basically just cheering at our own slavery. And so I was just wondering what you think about that analogy and how it fits our modern times.

Jason: Well do you know the origin of the word scapegoat?

Corey: No I don't.

Jason: From Greek society they would sort of blame all the sins of the city on a single person who wasn't actually guilty of it. And then they would do whatever it is that they did, some sort of Bacchanal thing where they'd chase them out of town, or kill them or all kinds of different stories. Who knows if it's at all true? But the whole idea was to basically expunge the sins of a city or grouping of people, they would pick somebody, even someone at random, and basically punish them for the sins of everybody else. And that's kind of like where this whole concept of scapegoating is. And this practice has continued on into today. And people don't think about it in those terms because we don't have a formalized ritual that everyone is privy to, but in a certain sense basically what happened is, this is just scapegoating. 9/11 was just scapegoating. All of this stuff is scapegoating. And American society is probably the most sinful society, in a certain sense. They are kind of like Sodom and Gomorrah all together plus Babylon plus everybody. [laughter]. There's a little bit of everything in American, which is kind of what makes it kind of cool and kind of great, but at the same time also makes it a little bit of a scary place to live. And so I kind of wonder if there's an almost twisted religious nature behind what's happened, in the subconscious of people, of expunging all of this then, trying to work this old magic, to save.

Corey: I totally see where you're coming from because right now, with the way things are going, it really does seem like our religion is murder. And like I was saying about slavery, our freedom is to be as depraved as we want to. That is like our freedom. So it's like our freedom is our slavery now. We have been - we've transited the circle so that our freedom's so joyous we can shout in the streets when people are killed, innocent people, who seem right now with all the evidence, to be innocent people, are just killed. And I'm not talking just about the bombing suspects, but obviously the others who were involved in the bombing. We just cheer on the powers that put all this into play, and then you know that all those people just went out and got drunk, watched whatever filthy movies they wanted to watch and then probably just - I don't even want to say it, because it's just from what you see, everyone now, just how crazy things have gotten.

Jason: It's bread and circuses.

Joe: Yeah.

Corey: Thank you.

Joe: That is pretty disgusting. I totally agree with you. And in terms of - I was just looking at those images of the people on the streets cheering and whooping and USAing it up. And it just struck me that these people were doing this in response to what was effectively martial law imposed on them, which was in response to ...

Corey: Yeah.

Joe: ... the public hunting and murder of two people. And yeah, it's a mix of cheering on martial law and getting your jollies from the public execution of two people.

Jason: That's what public execution as always about anyway?

Joe: About giving jollies to people?

Jason: Yeah.

Joe: Yeah, so are you feeling it over in the Midwest there as well? It's pretty much across the U.S., Corey?

Corey: Yeah. Are you talking about feeling that sense of martial law? Or just the feeling since the Boston bombing?

Joe: Yeah, feeling people kind of ...

Corey: Just like it's the same thing.

Joe: People feeling inappropriately ...

Jason: Jubilant.

Joe: ... jubilant about what happened.

Corey: No, in our sleepy little city, people don't talk about that kind of stuff. We have been fortunate enough to have been sheltered from a lot of the economic deprivation, you know, the foreclosures crisis never hit. So people aren't suffering enough to probably really even be paying attention to these kinds of things. Most people around here are still focused on 'how do we help one another, kind of come together just in case something bad does happen'. But just from what I see, it's a lot of - there's still a lot of complacency, just like everywhere else, but no one's even really talking about it, not at all really. It's kind of sad. It's really sad. The only time they talk about it, is when they complain when it's on the news. It's like 'oh, why isn't there anything else on the news?'. That's the only thing I've heard so far which is - that's a strange fact in and of itself.

Joe: That's the second deadly sin in this situation, is apathy to it. Ignoring it when it's happening in your country.

Corey: Yeah. It absolutely is.

Joe: Okay Corey thanks for your call.

Corey: Okay, before I go I just wanted to say thank you again because what you're doing is really a priceless service. Thank you for your great work. I enjoy listening to it.

Joe: Thank you.

Niall: Take care Corey.

Corey: Alright.

Joe: Yeah, we're getting some messages here about my repeated comment about the murder of two people, that one of them's still alive. As far as I'm concerned, in this context, the younger brother, is just a kid, will not be speaking to anybody.

Jason: And he will never see the light of day.

Joe: And he will not survive - so he may not be dead right now, but he's as good as dead. So when I say the execution of two people, that's pretty much what happened. Because there's a breaking kind of story as well, that - well just in the context of what happened with him, he had lived in a boat for a whole day he was supposedly on the run. The whole story is ridiculous.

Jason: Like a bad movie.

Joe: He had up to 10,000 ...

Niall: Armoured personnel.

Joe: ... armoured personnel in a very small suburban area, couldn't find this one guy. They had infrared cameras on helicopters, all sorts of stuff. And they supposedly couldn't find him for the whole day. They eventually found him in a boat, in someone's boat in a back yard that was covered with a tarp. And they claimed that he had been injured. He was lying in the boat injured, and he had lost a lot of blood by the time that he was found. But they got this remote control device in to rip the tarp off the boat.

Jason: Jesus Christ!

Joe: And they threw a flash bang grenade in a relatively small boat where he was in. But apparently he had a gunshot wound to his throat and his leg and had lost a lot of blood by the time he came out. But there's a still of him coming out of the boat, on his own - not being taken out - coming out of the boat on his own. He's climbing out of the boat, supposedly in a critical condition, then immediately whisked to hospital and immediately in a critical condition, but he was able to climb out of the boat on his own. And there's a breaking story now that's being spread around the bullshit wire, which is the mainstream media, which is that he put a gun, as well as the wound to his throat and his leg, he put a gun in his mouth and fired, as he was cornered in the boat, right? So that's a third gunshot wound and he put a gun in his mouth and shot himself through the mouth and then climbed out of the boat and surrendered to police.

Jason: Doesn't sound like Murat type of shit, you know.

Joe: But the wounds from putting the gun in his mouth and shooting himself means, according the mainstream media now ...

Niall: He will never be able to talk.

Joe: He will never be able to be quizzed. So okay, maybe the walking dead. I take back my comment that he was executed. He's just been basically taken out in another way. He may still have a heartbeat, but he's as good as dead.

Jason: Yeah, but even if they put him in a hole for the next 60, 70 years, somebody who's in prison for life, has been executed from a certain perspective.

Joe: Yeah.

Jason: They are dead. They don't have a life anymore. Their life has been taken away.

Niall: It's like the guy ...

Joe: So there's that ridiculous scenario around the younger brother and the night before - so he was caught at about 7:00, 7:30 in the evening eventually when they got to him and he's been hiding out in this suburb all day ..

Jason: Bleeding.

Joe: Bleeding all day, but is able to climb out of the boat. And then they find him, whatever, take him away and he's not going to speak now, all that kind of stuff. So that's all just highly suspicious and does not make any sense whatsoever. It sound like a load of bullshit, made up. The older brother who was caught the night before ...

Niall: Late Thursday night, yeah.

Joe: ... in the early hours of the morning, I think maybe 12:00, 1:00 in the morning on Friday morning.

Niall: Yeah.

Joe: He supposedly walked down the street, kind of John Wayne style, shooting at the cops after this car chase. Got out of the car, walked down the street, was shooting at them, and then ran out of bullets. And they were exchanging fire. There was one report from a policeman - from the Boston police chief said that he was walking down the street, just got out of the car, walked down the street, guns blaring type thing - like Murat - until he ran out of bullets. And he was exchanging fire with one of the officers, one of the Boston police chief's officers, from a distance of 5 to 10 feet. That's not much further than from me to you. And they were blamming away at each other, right? Then he runs out of bullets, nothing happens, nobody gets killed. So then another officer comes in when he runs out of bullets and tackles him to the ground. Right?

Jason: Right.

Joe: So then he's taken to the hospital and he dies within two hours. And the coroner says that he has multiple gunshot wounds and serious, serious trauma to his body in terms of lacerations that maybe look like they're associated with some kind of an explosive device. And then you have a video that has been - as far as we know unidentified - actually I've just seen a report now, but I will get to that. But we have this video of someone who looks exactly like the guy from his previous images, walking down the street and getting into a police car with no marks on him whatsoever. And they claim now - I'm just seeing a report here - (bad audio) website saying that this naked man - now they put out that this naked man was seen, who looks exactly like the older brother, was not a suspect in the Boston bombings. So they're covering their tracks all the way along here.

Jason: They just perp-walked some naked dude down the street for no reason?

Joe: Yeah.

Jason: Okay.

Niall: But, when that was first aired and went viral, that was the crowning moment. That was like the moment that the manhunt was successful and 'We won! We won!' That's when all the jubilation started I think.

Joe: No, no, it was the next day when they got the other guy because he was hiding out in the suburbs.

Niall: Okay.

Joe: And was a dire threat - a 19-year-old pot smoking kid who just wanted to get rich, as his tweet said, and wanted money and parties and stuff like that ...

Jason: Get rich or die trying.

Joe: Yeah. And smoked pot a lot, who was hiding out, was this terrible threat to this entire suburb, or entire city of Boston, because the whole place was locked down. And 10,000 people couldn't find him. And then they all wet their pants because they found him. And you know, what happened was that both of these people were executed, or were abused and have been rendered - one of them's been murdered and the other one has been rendered ...

Niall: A vegetable.

Joe: Basically a vegetable by the police. Both of them were set up and both of them were patsies and it's all a massive farce. And American people are cheering it on, or just ignoring it. And it will be unto their own destruction because when you accept that kind of bullshit from the authorities, who try to scare you, terrorise you into accepting, bowing down and kissing the feet of authority, and it's basically a police state that they're trying to put in place through this process, what do you expect to happen? Where do you think it's going to go? Is it just for fun? Are they doing this just for fun? This is basically a psychopathic ideology essentially. Just craving power and control over people as an end in itself.

Jason: Right.

Joe: It is the end; control and authority and rulement over people, lording it over people and squeezing them and controlling them. And ultimately psychopaths - a lot of psychopaths enjoy killing people as well, just so you know. They enjoy killing you. And it doesn't matter. They don't care. Black-skinned, dark-skinned Americans, whatever. They'll enjoy killing anybody on the same basis. And people who don't understand this because they say "Well look, but when these guys get up on TV and express themselves, they're so charming and they say all the right words. They don't look like the kind of people who'd do that. You're describing a monster."

Well Hervey Cleckley wrote a book called The Mask of Sanity which was about psychopaths. And he described exactly what they are like, which is that they are extremely charming, extremely articulate and create a very good impression. But behind it, they're completely devoid of empathy and don't give a shit whether you live or die, and in fact they want you to die. Ultimately, they want to control and dominate and abuse and murder and kill you. They want to destroy you. They have a destructive principle. And this is the people who are in positions of power. So all you have to do, American people, and people of the world, is grok the fact that you cannot judge a freakin' book by it's cover.

These people who look charming, and appear charming, and say all the right words, look at their deeds. Obama, whoever you want to pick out amongst your authorities, these are the people who are all very charming, they're articulate and stuff. But they're sending drones every day, around the world, to kill people they know are innocent. They lied to you, deliberate and constantly. Everybody knows this right? They lied to you about the Iraq war. They deliberately invaded another country. And you think they don't know, or they didn't know, that when they launched a war against Iraq - it wasn't a war, it was an invasion - when they invaded Iraq, they didn't know that hundreds of thousands of people, and over 1.5 million people were going to die? And they did it for no good reason. That's why they had to lie to you? But still you fall back on the idea that "But he's so charming".

Well just look at what he does. Forget about how charming or how nice his suit is, or how well spoken he is, and look at what they have done. They have lied to you blatantly, in an effort to get your support, to allow them to go and kill hundreds of thousands, millions of people because they enjoy it. And now they're doing it to you. Now they're setting you up for the same action, for the same treatment. So, there you go.

Jason: But in a certain sense, I think that there's a large percentage of the population that have a very strong submissive streak. They actually kind of want to be sacrificed, in a certain sense. They want to be sacrificial. I think that they like it and they get off on it in some sort of weird, twisted way.

Joe: Up to a certain point. Surely the don't want to be ...

Jason: I think that they really want to die and stuff. I think that they really do, you know. There's no other explanation because people are - at a certain point the lies are so blatantly lies, and people are so - what's the word for it - they're like pigs in shit. They're just groveling in it and running around. They really get off on it and they really like this whole totalitarian government thing because it's exciting for them. There's a terrorist attack and then the police come out and shoot stuff. They have infrared cameras and it's just like a movie.

Niall: With the drones overhead.

Jason: Drones overhead. They really get off on it.

Joe: They're excited about it. But they don't think that it's ultimately going to ...

Niall: They don't realise this is the opening chapter in this being an every-day reality for them. I want to read out some descriptions of the jubilation in Boston. This is from the Associated Press.

After the capture celebratory bells rang from a church tower. Crowds lined the streets into the centre of town. Teenagers waved American flags. Every car that drove by honked. Every time an emergency vehicle went by people cheered loudly. Lois Johnson, a 49-year-old attorney had spent the day inside with her son. So when the celebrations started, they came out with a container of cookies they had baked and started handing them out.

Joe: Oh Christ.

Niall: (continuing Associated Press article):
'When you see your town invaded like this, it's stunning' says Roger, 65. 'Everyone in Watertown is just so grateful that he's caught and that we're liberated.'
And in a way there, he's giving it away. They were very much not free.

Joe: They've been liberated.

Niall: It's kind of a combination of relief and a sadistic enjoyment of it. Both are mixed in there. I guess at least some of the people would have been terrified by what's going down.

Joe: I've only got one thing to say. [Plays song]. Sorry about that.

Niall: Well that's appropriate.

Joe: I don't know how that got in there.

Niall: [laughs] "Hundreds of people march down Commonwealth Avenue chanting 'USA! USA!' and singing the Red Sox anthem, Sweet Caroline - oh my god! - as they head up toward Boston Common." The police actually blocked traffic to make way for an impromptu parade.

Joe: They just take it way too far. Wooooooowwwwwwwwww! I don't know what to say about that kind of stuff. We live in a world gone mad or at least sections of it have gone really over the edge at this point. And it's terrible because I'm kind of conflicted because I know that a lot of ordinary people out there who might feel that kind of jubilation, it's a sense of relief after a fear and terror that was imposed on them and suddenly they have this release of emotion because they were terrorised by their own government, basically. And so they want to let of a bit of steam and stuff, but seriously, there needs to be some thinking brought in here when those kind of emotions are involved. You need to bring your critical thinking capacities in because that's what's going to save you ultimately, because most people have the emotional age of a child. And they're not going to be able to navigate this world very well in the state that it's in, and the way that it's ruled, they're not going to be able to navigate this world very well based on their emotional responses.

Because that is how people are being controlled. That is how the powers that be have understood is the best way to control people. It's through their emotions. And if your emotions are already juvenile, you're screwed because you're just going to be like a Pavlovian dog, just going to be push a button and you react. So if you cannot bring in any of your - and at least there's an opportunity for people to develop their intellectual capacities a little more than their emotional capacities. And that's your only potential safeguard against that, is to say "Hang on a minute. Let's think about this".

Niall: Am I getting the whole picture? What else is out there? It does not take much effort to - there must be some things in your mind when you see one claim versus another claim, both from official sources, one directly contradicting the other one. Do you not go "Well, okay. There's a contradiction there. I know, I'll just google it. Maybe someone made a mistake somewhere down the line." That little spark of curiosity could go a long way.

Joe: But the problem is, people have to follow it. And if they follow it, it goes to places that they don't want to go because they're so identified with a belief system that has been inculcated in them or they have been infected with it really, because the infection of a belief system that is completely false, and it doesn't match to the reality around them. And that's what you've got to do. You've got to try and weigh up what you believe, based on what's actually happening in the world around you and see if they match. And if they don't, your best option is to go with the reality around you rather than your belief system.

Jason: 'Honey, did you hear what they said? They said that the bullet couldn't have done what they said it done. Oh look, American Gladiators.' [laughter]

Joe: That reminds me.
[BILL HICKS]: Kennedy. I love talking about the Kennedy assassination. Because to me it's a great example of a totalitarian government's ability to manage information and thus keep us in the dark, anyway they - sorry, wrong meeting. Shit. That's the meeting we're having tomorrow at the docks. I love talking about Kennedy. I was just down in Dallas, Texas. You know you can go down there and to Dealey Plaza, where Kennedy was assassinated. And you can actually go to the sixth floor of the School Book Depository. It's a museum called 'The Assassination Museum'. I think it was named that after the assassination. I can't be too sure of the chronology here, but anyway they have the window set up to look exactly like it did on that day. And it's really accurate, you know, because Oswald's not in it. [laughter and applause] Yeah. So painstaking accuracy, you know. It's true. It's called the Sniper's Nest. It's glassed in. It's got the boxes sitting there. And you can't actually get to the window itself. And the reason they did that of course, they didn't want thousands of American tourists getting there each year going "NO FUCKING WAY! I CAN'T EVEN SEE THE ROAD. SHIT, THEY'RE LYING TO US! FUCK!! WHERE ARE THEY?! THERE'S NO FUCKING WAY!! NOT UNLESS OSWALD WAS HANGING BY HIS TOES UPSIDE DOWN FROM THE LEDGE! EITHER THAT OR SOME PIGEONS GRABBED ONTO HIM, FLEW HIM OVER THE MOTORCADE. SURELY SOMEONE WOULD HAVE SEEN THAT!!
Joe: That was provoked by Jason making a reference to JFK. That was just Bill Hicks who, through humour, was trying to present the truth of the JFK assassination. We could do a show on that, going back to kind of when it all really started going downhill.

Niall: Well there's something he says at the end of that rant, "Oh good honey. I heard on the news that what they said was that Oswald's gun went off and then there was an echo in Dealey Plaza. Now honey, what time's gladiators on at?"

Jason: American Gladiators.

Niall: And Bill, he says "I'm so glad we're free. Free to do as we tell you. You're free to do as we tell you". And he was picking up on the saturation of misinformation in the media and the entertainment of it all. Completely obscures any idea of what really is going on out there.

Jason: Well what's really interesting, as a side note that is very pertinent to that: before I left Florida, there was a reporter at Fox News - I'm pretty sure Fox - who applied for - she got fired or something like that because of something that she had done. She basically had told people that Fox had fabricated the story. I can't remember which story it was. So they fired her and so then she was applying for some sort of whistleblower type thing and whatever it was. And she went to court with Fox News and the judge basically said to her, he said "It's all fine and good, but news companies are not legally obligated to tell you the truth because technically they're entertainment companies." There's actually no law that says that the news company has to tell you the truth, that they are considered in the eyes of the law to be just for entertainment purposes only.

Niall: If corporations respond to shareholders.

Joe: They've been fulfilling that remit since forever, entertaining people with bullshit.

Jason: The news has always been about entertainment, America. That wasn't the original idea of the press. The press is the organ of the people and for reporting on the government. That was their original purpose and mandate. But they haven't fulfilled that in more than 100 years. They haven't fulfilled that since before the Civil War in which they were very big into the propaganda that started the Civil War as well.

Joe: Yeah.

Niall: And we get to today and this event being reported. I'm thinking particularly the manhunt and lockdown. There's not one thing adds up. Even before they were apprehended - or shot dead, there's supposed to have been a wild car chase in downtown Boston that ended up with - no, it didn't begin - the opening shot - the reason they were onto their trail was supposedly because two guys walked up to a police officer, started chatting him up on MIT campus and just shot him dead. The guy didn't even have a chance to draw his gun. So he was in no way suspicious of whoever these two people were.

Joe: That was somebody else that shot him, in my opinion because that was an important, crucial aspect of implicating them too - those two brothers. Somebody had to die because there was no - there is no evidence directly linking them to the bombing, other than the fact that they are in pictures, like hundreds of other people, around the finish line of the Boston Marathon. There are only two pieces of evidence that links them to it: one of them is the testimony of the guy who was splashed around the newspapers all around the world, who had his legs blown off in the bombing and was being wheeled in a wheelchair by a guy in a cowboy hat.

Niall: Yeah, his name was Jeff Bauman.

Joe: Jeff Bauman, yeah. He was in hospital, a day or two later, and was just in and out of consciousness, and was full of drugs, obviously, in his condition. And supposedly he said, that he identified - or he was able to identify the older brother, saying that he had looked at him straight in the face and dropped his backpack beside him, and two minutes later the backpack blew up.

Niall: Actually he didn't positively identify that it was one of the brothers. What happened was, he scribbled down - he wasn't even able to speak - he scribbled down 'bag, saw the guy, looked right at me.' And then he described to an FBI agent who came to his hospital bed, that he'd seen a man in sunglasses and black baseball cap that walked right up to him, placed the black backpack on the ground and stepped away.

Joe: Mm-hm.

Niall: So he did not actually positively identify that it was the older Chechen brother.

Joe: So it was just some guy. He just said 'some guy'...

Niall: Some guy. well, the idea is that he saw the images being spread around on the news. I think the FBI released images of the two brothers on the Wednesday and then in response to that he said that's when he recognized them. But he never actually said - it's a shoe-in that that's what happened, that he saw their faces and that's how he knew it was one of them that had been next to him and placed the bag. So that's the one tenuous link.

Jason: Hold on. They released the photos for the cop shooting, right? Not for the terrorist suspects?

Niall: No they released the photos for the terrorist, for the bombings.

Jason: Right, but how did they get on to them? They got on to them because of the cop shooting, right?

Niall: No.

Joe: No, they got on to him because this guy in the hospital who had his legs blown off in the bombing, supposedly in the state of delirium, full of drugs, a day or two later in the hospital, with his legs amputated, just momentarily woke up, is the way they're describing it, and positively identified, or give the FBI a tip saying, this guy looked at me, and dropped the bag, and the bomb happened two minutes later and...

Jason: Why were the Chechen brothers on the TV?

Joe: Because they had shown pictures of potential people who were...

Jason: Ohhh.

Joe: ...because they had people - they had asked people to go and send in their pictures or whatever. But the FBI itself obviously had an operation where they rented a warehouse somewhere in the U.S. and got all the images they could possibly get from sorts of cameras that were in the area and laid them all out and looked at all the film and footage of the security cameras and stuff and did their own research to try and identify potential suspects.

Jason: I think they were playing Canasta the whole time [laughs].

Joe: They probably were.

Jason: They were probably faking it. 'Yeah we set up a crime lab!'

Niall: In the two days before they sent out images, these are suspects one and two, have you seen them? There were no leads and they were encouraging members of the public to send them whatever info or photos they have from that day. They even set up a website for people to send their images to. In the meantime, in the alternative media, people were collecting images from spectators, or, somehow I think there were still some cameras also on public websites. What's interesting is that the public, and then the alternative media who carried it, picked up on a whole set of other guys in black caps, black dark glasses and wearing backpacks. Now this is before the images of the two brothers have gone out. And it does look like there was a team of people. There were several images, there might be six or seven of these guys. They're all wearing the same stuff, black jackets, tan pants, combat boots. Some of them have black backpacks. Some didn't. One of them is seen holding some kind of, I think it was Natural News identified it as - or speculated that it was some kind of radioactive device like a Geiger counter. And there is at least one photo where you can see that they seem to have ear pieces and they're listening in on something.

Jason: Yeah I saw those photos.

Niall: Now there's a team of these guys milling around the finish line. And there's no official explanation for who they were or what they're doing there. There are a couple of ideas. Some people have identified them as being mercenaries for a company called Craft International.

Jason: Noooo.

Niall: And then there is another guy who says that these were part of a response team. Officially this group have a - I've got an article here, "Members of an elite anti-terror unit from Brooklyn's 4th Hamilton Army base were deployed to Boston to assist in the recovery effort following the horrific April 15th bombing. The problem is, these guys were photographed before the bomb went off, standing in the exact spot where the first bomb went off.

Jason: So here's the thing. When I was taking Aikido back in Florida, my sensei would tell this story about a guy who came in, and this is Florida right, right north of Tampa. Guy came in, dressed in full ninja garb, and said, "I want to cross study in your Martial Art." And he used to tell the joke, he said, "If you were a real ninja, you would have come in with a Hawaiian shirt and white shoes, looking just like an old man!" Those guys looked like mercenaries. What kind of professional mercenary would go to a crowd dressed like a mercenary? You know they look like movie mercenaries, you know?

Niall: Exactly, exactly, this is the thing. There are - the alternative media has taken this and run with it.

Jason: It's a red herring.

Niall: It must be, because why would they be so obviously identifiable?

Jason: Yeah.

Niall: They're wearing the same gear, they've got headsets on, earpieces. They were hanging around in the immediate aftermath.

Jason: That's kind of the American mentality for security though, big, buff guys with ear-pieces up front type of thing, you know?

Niall: Yeah.

Jason: So maybe that is in line with that. Maybe they were there for the purposes of making it look like security was there.

Niall: I think they were there as part of whatever cross-operation was at work, that there was a drill there that day. We have other evidence that there was a drill going on.

Joe: There is clear evidence that there was a drill going on. In fact, I'm just going to play you a little audio clip of an eyewitness. And he's just one of several people who provided evidence, eye-witness testimony, that there was a drill.
Audio Clip:
News Anchor: "Several runners from our area are in Boston. They were running in the marathon. Several we talked with were not far from the explosions when they happened today."

Lady: Local 15's John Dzenitis is live in our newsroom right now. John, the University of Mobile's Cross Country coach actually saw the explosion happen?

Reporter Dzenitis: That's right Kim, he had just finished the marathon and was walking back to the finish line to meet up with his wife. That's when the explosion started going off. His wife had been sitting in the section where one of the explosions went off, but thankfully she had left her seat to come meet up with him. He says there was just this thick, blinding cloud of white smoke. They all started running. The coach told me though, this is interesting, before the marathon he saw bomb-sniffing dogs and bomb spotters on the roofs at the starting line and it appeared to him there was some sort of active threat before the explosions went off."

Coach: "At the start line this morning, they had, bomb spotters on the roofs of the buildings, and they had bomb-sniffing dogs coming up and down at the start line. And Melanie said there was bomb-sniffing dogs at the finish line. But they kept making announcements saying, to the participants, 'Do not worry. This is a just a training exercise.' Well, evidently I don't believe they were just having a training exercise, I think they must of known, they must have had some kind of threat or suspicions called in."

Reporter Dzenitis: "Now Coach Stevenson told me he's run plenty of marathons in D.C. and Chicago, and other major metropolitan areas, but he's never seen that many bomb-sniffing dogs for a race. For right now reporting live in the newsroom, John Dzenitis, Local 15 news."

Lady Reporter: "John, thank you. Just a horrible ordeal..."
Joe: So that was the University of Mobile's Cross Country coach, Allie Stevenson, who was near the finish line of the marathon when the explosions went off, saying that he thought it was odd that there were - well he saw spotters, and he heard people say that there was a drill going on.

Niall: And he goes to a lot of marathons.

Joe: And he said he was surprised that there were so many bomb-sniffing dogs at the start and finishing lines, as well as law enforcement spotters on roofs of buildings. And even he goes so far as to say that it wasn't just that they were having a drill, that they must have known that there was something going on there. I don't know whether that's true or not, because they can have a drill around a fake scenario. But it's very strange that they would have some kind of a serious drill like that, where police would have to act at an area where there was a marathon finishing with so many people. It doesn't sound plausible. It would have to be a very low-key drill. But the other serious piece of evidence that there was a drill at least going on, but a drill that, strangely, like in so many other drills, coincided with exactly what happened. The drill went live somehow or other.

Niall: Well is that...

Joe: Two hours before the bombs went off, the Boston Globe tweeted that officials had said that in one minute there would be a controlled explosion opposite the library. Now the bombs went off directly opposite the public library at the finish line of the marathon, two hours after that tweet was sent out by the Boston Globe.

Niall: The exact tweet was: 'There will be a controlled explosion opposite the library within one minute as part of bomb squad activities.' Nothing more said! Ha! They just left it at that! Of course, there was no bomb within one minute, that was at 1:00 pm.

Joe: Yeah.

Niall: But two hours later, kaboom!

Joe: Exactly. That's just, what are the odds?

Niall: What's going on there?

Joe: What's going on is that someone is seeding information. It seems to me that there is a complex kind of plan that has been put in place to have a drill going on, or have law enforcement at least aware of a drill or somebody putting the word out that there's a drill going on around the marathon finish line, on that day, around that time, around the time that they planned to detonate the bombs. First of all, as a cover for having certain people in there, you know, maybe people - obviously if you're going to plant a bomb somewhere and you're going to do it from the perspective of someone who has a lot of power and control, you're not just some terrorist type thing, you want to control the situation. So you want to have your people in there, making sure everything goes down the way it should go down.

Jason: Right.

Joe: So you want to have a reason why there might be extra individuals in there, extra people from other law enforcement, or you know, not very well known law enforcement, or intel agencies or whatever, on the scene, on that day, so that police who are staffing the marathon as a normal part of their job, aren't wondering and understand who these guys are. These guys in the camo pants, so they have free reign to operate, basically. So the people who are actually carrying out the explosion covertly, have free reign to operate. And that maybe just a little leak, you know what I mean? Where they had to tell the local police who weren't involved, and then someone did the wrong thing and told the press or something, or somehow got to the press, and the press tweeted it.

Jason: I think there's an easier explanation, and one that unfortunately is going to sound bad but still I think is probably true. When somebody went to update the website, the servers probably located in a different time zone, and the time was saved in the wrong time and displayed in the wrong time, I think.

Joe: Yeah, possibly.

Jason: We'd have to see, compare all the dates from the previous tweets and see if they're out of synch by an hour or two.

Niall: The thing is, as soon as the bombings happened, the real bombings at 3 pm, not long after the alternative media were already picking up on this. And this was the main - there was both the guy we've just listened to who was saying it was weird that there was this drill going on, bomb-sniffing dogs and so on, and the other big piece of evidence was this tweet. So it was being discussed, that they had announced before-hand that there would be a controlled explosion within one minute opposite the - they just call it the library. Now, at a 5 pm press conference, two hours later, they made reference to a fire that had taken place at the JFK Library, specifically, and that...

Joe: That was miles away.

Niall: That was in a totally different location. And, they were very vague about it. It was weird. It was like, "Oh yeah, there was a fire, possibly an incendiary device, don't worry, we're on it."

Jason: That stuff I think is red herring stuff.

Niall: That was dropped. That story was dropped like a hot potato.

Joe: Mm-hm.

Niall: Now the library, in the tweet they didn't say which library. But the Boston Public Library is the one that's directly opposite where the bomb went off.

Joe: And that tweet was in the context of the Boston Globe tweeting about the marathon because they were covering the marathon. And that tweet was part of tweets that were about the marathon. So it seems obvious that the public library that they were talking about was the public library right opposite. Why would they be 0 you know what I mean?

Niall: Yeah, the spectator stand was actually built up against the side of the building.

Joe: Exactly. Yeah. So it's a totally - it's a very anomalous and bizarre thing to say. You can't have a controlled, can't just say 'oh controlled explosion at the marathon finish line in one minute' when there are a thousand people around.

Jason: Just FYI!!!

Niall: It was weird.

Jason: I think that kind of stuff is red herring for people to latch onto, it's like there's nothing really there. It's probably intentional.

Joe: Yeah.

Jason: Somebody was just messing with people. They knew they'd spot it. It's like fetishism and television shows. They have this concept called fetishism, where they basically plant little tidbits into television shows that aren't really explained, and they never intend to, for the purposes that fans will basically become obsessed with them and talk about them all the time. And they call them basically fan fetishes. And the terrorists, these are terrorism fetishes, so the conspiracy nuts can latch on to these inconsistent details. But they're inconsistent because somebody was just saying, 'oh throw that out there.'

Niall: Exactly.

Jason: Like John Cleese saying 'There is no fire on the wing!' You know that show? 'Nothing is wrong!' You know?

Niall: This is the kind of stuff that we saw when we were covering the Sandy Hook school shooting. Just information being put out there about, that were red herrings, but at the same time they spoke volumes in themselves, because for someone to have known those kinds of things at the time, implicates sources or very strongly suggests of foreknowledge. That's the very least we can say about this, even if it was a red herring, you know?

Joe: Yeah, and in terms of red herrings, I'd just like to say officially that the whole actors thing that has cropped up again...

Niall: Oh no!

Joe: anybody who does that shit like they did on Sandy Hook, are a bunch of lying, snivelling, pieces of disinformation spreading...(inaudible)!

Jason: (inaudible?)

Niall: They're already trying to suggest that some of the victims of who lost their legs, were actors and were using prosthetics and fake wounds.

Jason: Are you kidding me?! Oh my god! What is wrong with those people.

Joe: This started with Sandy Hook you know, it was all over Sandy Hook, and we had to go...

Jason: What, some of those dead kids were just like actors? Like all of them didn't exist?

Niall: Show us the bodies or we don't believe you did it!

Joe: It wasn't the kids, it was specifically the people who were interviewed, the of the community, members of the Sandy Hook community who were interviewed and stuff. And they were drawing all sorts of ridiculous conclusions from images of two people who obviously weren't the same people. There's a website that does it, that you don't even want to go to because it's so full of nonsense, you know?

Jason: No, thank you! Dude, Oh My God!

Joe: And they're doing the same thing, and this is either a conscious or unconscious - I don't know, maybe a deliberate disinformation campaign to make...

Jason: It is!

Joe: ...anybody who questions the official story seem like a nutcase. 'Oh, you're one of those 'actors people'! I mean, there's already a kind of actors, 'You're one of the staged actors people', if you question it at all. And these people are directly responsible and supposedly going to conspiracy theory extreme. The extreme fringe end of conspiracy theory, where 'it didn't actually happen', 'none of it happened', you know! 'It doesn't exist, those people don't exist!' 'They live somewhere else!' 'The whole thing was like a massive stage production', you know what I mean? 'If you look behind those trees you can see the lights and the cameras and the make-up artists'. They take it to ridiculous extremes and tar anybody who says 'hang on a minute, it doesn't make sense.' They started with Sandy Hook, and they're doing the same thing with the Boston Marathon and they've tried to say that this guy whose got his legs blown off, what's his name Niall?

Niall: Jeff Bauman.

Joe: Jeff Bauman is an Iraq war vet. Nick Vogt who had his legs amputated because he went to Iraq.

Niall: He's a double-leg amputee.

Joe: For completely the wrong reasons obviously. And, they're trying to say these two are the same people, when all you have to do is check to see they're NOT the same people, they don't even look anything alike, at all. So the whole staged thing - and I don't even want to go into it because it's so obvious. There is nothing staged. There are no actors. There were no actors at the Boston Marathon bombing. None of those people were placed there, No one was setting anybody up with fake prosthetic bloody limbs. Get over it. Shut up. Whatever. You're annoying my existence right now, so, just if you're a hero, slap you down!
All: [Laughter[

Joe: Niall, say something. Before I - say something!

Niall: Yeah, I don't think I'll be able to hold Joe back, so, if you do say something stupid, good luck to ya!

Jason: Verbally eviscerate those asshats. Oh my god dude! Seriously.

Joe: Terrible.

Jason: I mean, they're almost worse than the people who perpetrate the damn attacks in the first place. I mean, denying that they even happened, that's just criminal in my opinion. You know?

Niall: That army unit I was talking about, the guys who were...

Jason: The peers?

Niall: ...uniformed with, you know, were present at the finish line, who may or may not be from Craft International. I don't think they are, because there's a guy, a senator, that has come out and said...

Jason: Are you saying that Kraft Foods is now part of the security industry!?

Jason: We're Kraft International, we make cheese and mercenaries!

Joe: No, it's Craft with a 'C'.

Joe: Think Blackwater. Or Ravenwood, people like them. Think an ex-army, ex-U.S. military sniper, who was ,you know, 'Best Sniper of 2011' or something like that.

Jason: 150 confirmed kills? He was very impressive.

Joe: Yeah, well whatever. One of these, jumped up, serial killers who left the army.

Jason: What do you expect, he's a fucking sniper!

Joe: Exactly, he's a psycho-sniper. And he goes and forms a - you know he leaves the military, and goes and tries to make money off the Pentagon, from Pentagon contracts, by forming a security contractor company, gets a bunch of his buddies together and they all provide training courses and tell people how to kill other people most effectively.

Jason: It's a good American business model!

Joe: It's a mercenaries' market these days, with the terror, the ubiquitous terror all around. I mean if you want to start a company, start a mercenary company. If you've got the...

Jason: ...Or just security consulting.

Niall: I'm starting to lean towards it not being a security company/mercenaries, because there's a photo of a group of them at the end, helping out in the aftermath. Or at least they're standing around. And they have the letters marked on their back, CST.

Joe: Mm-hmm.

Niall: The senator said that they were part of this anti-elite - anti-elite, I wish! - elite anti-terror unit, said they were from the 24th National Guard WMD CST Team and they were sent in, in response. But of course they weren't. There were at least two of them photographed there in the exact spot where the bomb went off.

Jason: Right.

Niall: Now, they were due to be dismantled.

Jason: What do you mean dismantled?

Niall: "The U.S. Defense Department was poised as recently as last month to dismantle a National Guard Crisis Team that assisted in the emergency response to the bombings of Monday's Boston Marathon. Defense Secretary Chuck Hagel on March 29, informed law makers, inviting of plans to dismantle the New York based 24th National Guard Weapons of Mass Destruction Civil Support Team, as well as a similar WMD unit housed in Florida." Of course, now that they're being hailed as heroes...

Jason: Not going to happen.

Niall: They've got unlimited budget access.

Jason: Cui booooonnnnooooo!

Joe: Can we have a cui bono? Gimme a C!

Jason: Can I get a 'Hell Yeah!'?

Joe: Yeah, so, what we're dealing with here...

Jason: Well I mean, if you are a part of an Elite anti-Terrorist unit ,and then a terrorist attacked those right under your nose, you don't get to say 'Elite' anymore. The elite gets tagged off. They're an anti-Terrorist unit. Because, I mean, when you don't stop it, you can't be elite anymore.

Joe: Alright. I just want people to think about one thing: I'm going to play something to help you think. I want you to think about the fact that on the day of the Boston marathon bombs, there was clearly a drill going on. There was spotters on the roofs, and they were preparing for some kind of, or staging, or some kind of a pretend attack. They were in place to deal with that, different security personnel were in place to deal with that. And the Boston Globe sent out a message that security force personnel had said that there was going to be an explosion directly opposite the library where the bomb, the first bomb actually went off. Actually, keep that thought in mind. I'll say it again actually, because I've got a call. Hi Caller! What's your name and where are you calling from?

Jamar: Yes sir, I'm calling from Tacoma. My name is Jamar.

Joe/Jason: Hi Jamar.

Jamar: This Boston thing to me is like a, it's like very, very obvious that, like, they're doing something. And I'll give them more credit for what they did in the past and what they're doing now is more sloppy. And it's like, I see my fellow Americans, they don't notice it. When I say certain things, they don't get it, you know? And like, I'm a student of - not egotistically, but I'm a student of - I'm really interested in the Kennedy assassination. And like a lot of things from that, I learned from what's going on with this, and like, it's just not - [sigh] - they're sloppy! You know, this is obvious what's going on. They would talk about what's going on in Waco, in Texas, and in comets and stuff. It's like they're trying to distract you from what's going on from - what's REALLY going on. It's just like, I can't even talk to other Americans about this because they just look at me like I'm stupid.

Niall: Yeah, far from it.

Joe: But maybe that answers your comment about it being sloppy. Maybe it's only sloppy for people who can see, maybe there are so many Americans who can't see it, that it's just, you know, right for them in terms of fooling them, know what I mean?

Jamar: Yeah, yeah.

Jason: And to a certain degree they're always sloppy. You know, I mean...

Joe: There's always holes.

Jason: There's always holes in their story.

Jamar: They're not creative!

Joe: They're not creative, but that's the nature of the beast, if you know what I mean. They don't have that kind of creativity.

Jason: But they don't have to be, as it turns out.

Niall: If it worked once, try it again!

Joe: People who are into killing other people generally don't have that creative spark within them? The creative spark is to create things not destroy, you know?

Jamar: Yeah, yeah, yeah! You wrote that article about JFK and the fucking crazies.

Joe: Yeah.

Jamar: You know what I'm talking about?

Joe: Yeah.

Jamar: You know, I read that and it made a lot of sense to me. You know, I went to work and I had to go through things that - you know, you work everyday and you have to do what you have to do, you know what I'm saying? But you try to balance it out. I try to balance out what I do. I try not to, I try to, I try to not live to work. But I mean, I try to work so I can live, you know? So like, you guys, what you guys do, SOTT, you know what I'm saying, it's like, like, people can know what's going on, you know what I'm saying? Right now, right now in America it's bad. And the reason why I know it's bad is because when I talk to other people, people that I'm close to, they don't get it. You know what I'm saying? This Boston, this whole thing, they don't get it, and this was sloppy! This was nothing like the Kennedy assassination, all these other false flag operations, 9-11, or anything. It's sloppy! Know what I'm saying? This is like, really like, I mean, I know you guys probably saw these same suspect pictures that I saw, pictures of operatives, contractors or whatever they may be. I mean, you could see some of this stuff on Infowars, and those guys are full of shit!

Niall: Yeah.

Jamar: You know, I don't support Alex Jones. But I mean like, you know, I mean, common. You know what I'm saying? Something here is not adding up. And everybody is falling for it? I think that the big premise of all this is comets.

Joe: Well, you could be on to something there. In fact, we might want to just quickly talk about that, you know?

Jason: We have a segue to it.

Joe: Yeah, that's a good introduction to it. So, thanks for your call, Jamar.

Jamar: Thank you, sir. Thank you.

Jason: Take it easy, bro!

Joe: Take it easy. Be safe/

Jamar: Alright, you too.

Joe: Yeah, so back to my point, I was basically saying ok, there was a drill, there was a tweet saying there was going to be a bomb, an explosion, exactly where there was an explosion two hours later. There was a drill going on. The whole thing was encased in the idea of a drill. And a bomb went off where, it seems, the drill had planned for a bomb to go off. That seems to be the take home message. And I'm just going to play a quick thing, a quick audio clip from the London tube bombings right now, so you can make your own connections.
Official: Today we are running an exercise for a company, bearing in mind I'm now in the private sector, and we sat everybody down in the City, a thousand people involved in the whole organization, the Crisis Team. And the most peculiar thing was, we based our scenario on the simultaneous attacks on the Underground and mainline station. So we had to suddenly switch an exercise from fictional to real. And one of the first things is, get that bureau number, when you have a list of people missing, tell them. And it took a long time.

Reporter: Just to get this right, you were actually working today on an exercise that envisioned virtually this scenario?

Official: Ah, almost precisely. I was up until two o'clock this morning, because its our job. My own company Visor, Consultants, we specialize in helping people to get their crisis management response. How do you jump from slow-time thinking to quick-time doing. And we chose a scenario, with their assistance, which is based on a terrorist attack, because they're very close to a property occupied by Jewish businessmen. They're in the City and there are more American banks in the City than there are in the whole of New York. A logical thing to do. And it, I've still got it...

Reporter: How extraordinary today must feel for you as it unfolds.
Joe: Yeah. How extraordinary it must have felt to realize that, the drill that you had planned actually happened in real time. To go from drill to real time scenario exactly as you had planned it, exactly as someone had planned it. And that's the point. There was a drill going on in Boston, that there would be a bomb exactly where there was a bomb. And the point of that is, the point of putting the drill around that, is to allow for the personnel that need to be in - the people who are behind the bombing to be there to control it. To control the immediate aftermath and make sure that nothing - because you can't just go out, you can't just be one guy, if you're a member of some secret, murky, dirty, .U.S intel agency that is tasked, or that desires to control the population through terrorism and wants to drop a bomb somewhere, you can't just drop a bomb and walk away, you know, leave it there the night before and let it blow up, or leave it there an hour before, or whatever. Someone might find it! A policeman. If you don't tell anybody else, if you don't tell all of the enforcement, police officers that are around, if they're not all in on it, the chances are that they're going to find it, that it's not going to go the way you planned it.

You want to plan it quite meticulously, right? You want to make sure it happens. And you want to make sure you get away with it. And you want to make sure the patsies that you've set up get hit for it, get the rap for it. Right? You want to make sure of all these things. You can't just drop the bomb and walk away, you have to plan it so one of the - obviously they have decided that one of the best ways to do that is to plan a DRILL around it. Because drills are needed because there's Terrorism, right? And then they create the reality of terrorism by planting a bomb and then you can have more drills, more drills, you expand the reach of the drills across the entire U.S. You can drill, an emergency terror drill at any time, in any city across the U.S. now because there have been bombs, because there is a real terror threat, which means you can plant more bombs! Wherever you want! And have your people in place to control the entire situation and set it up the way you want.

Jason: The question that immediately strikes my mind is how incompetent are these douchebags, to be honest? I mean, you have this area surround by police, bomb sniffing dogs, all of the technology that they have been developing for the last eleven years after the 9/11 attacks, everything converging on this one point, and they still can't stop the bomb! I mean Jesus Christ, what's wrong these people!? It's incompetence, grotesque incompetence!

Joe: A lot of it shows the control - the problem is that there's a hierarchy, you know? Your average policeman in Boston defers to the FBI, or defers to the guys in the suits.

Jason: Homeland Security.

Joe: The Homeland Security. The guys in the suits, they're the ones so whatever they say goes. And they're the guys who are behind it. I mean, you dress in the suit, you have a security clearance, you've got your dark glasses on. You've got enough of your people in like that and you can do what you want. You can lead the average copper around by the nose. We've got another call here. Hi caller, what's your name and where are you calling from?

Chris: Hey! This is Chris, I'm calling from the United States of Insanity.

Joe: [Laughing] OK!

Jason: [Laughing] Welcome, dude.

Chris: What's going on guys? Yeah, you guys are talking about these drills and incompetence and so forth and so on, I thought I could - I actually have experience in this. I could probably give a perspective on how these things are actually conducted. You know, kind of an awareness kind of a thing. My experience actually is in the military, and the military actually goes through the same type of drills, terrorism drills, massive disaster drills. And one of the things that I'm looking at the Boston, when you're looking at these different scenarios that involve drills, is when you're actually on the ground and going through it, you actually begin to understand why it is that these things are ridiculous, you know what I mean? So many holes, like the previous caller had said, it was sloppy. One of the reasons is, is because when they throw this thing together, whenever they do drills, it's always thrown in with multiple agencies that you've never actually done anything with before previously.

Joe: Mm-hm.

Chris: You know? And when you're going through it they tell you, for example, 'Ok, we're going to have an earthquake simulation', okay? This whole area is going, you know, and they're going to have a different - no one knows what's going on. Never. You're not using the same guys you do on a regular basis. Everything is different. Sometimes you're using a swat team from another city. You know what I mean? They need to get their training in as well. This is how these things are thrown together. And none of it is done as it will actually be done in reality. They try to fix five or six different things at one time. 'Well this guy needs some training, we've got a national guard unit in from Alaska, they're going to be the EMTs' or whatever. And this is all how its compiled together. So literally when you're going out there and you're a response force, you're saying like 'what the heck is going on?' 'Who are these guys,' know what I'm saying? Nobody knows what's going on. So this is a perfect opportunity for an actual terrorist attack, because everybody is - you might have five, six, seven different agencies, some of them they're not even from your state.

Joe: Mm-hm.

Chris: Some of them are, like you said, contractors or consultants, but you never know what's going on. Nobody knows what's going on. As a whole.

Joe: Mm-hm, yeah.

Chris: So this is actually the reality when you're out there on the ground. And to this day I don't even know why this is how they do things. They call it 'crisis management', 'incident management' and so forth and so on. They give it a lot of different names, but the point is, its all the same thing and none of it ever makes any sense.

Joe: Yeah.

Jason: Well here's the answer to that question. The reason it's like that way is because they're not serious about it. I mean if they were serious about, if they were really serious about anti-terrorism and training people and having these training exercises, they wouldn't do it in this bullshit way.

Chris: Exactly.

Joe: Yeah, it's like you're saying Chris, its basically, if they bring in someone from Alaska or from two states away or something like that, what use is that for the event where its going to - say they bring it to Boston. What use is having a team from Alaska in there for a training drill or emergency management, for the eventuality where something real would happen in Boston? It's only going to be the local people in Boston who deal with it. You're not going to fly in, you know, in the immediate aftermath, you're not going to have access to people from two states away, or from Alaska. They're not going to be right there on the scene. So what's the point in even training with those people?

Chris: Well the justification that they give on this: 'Well they also need some training as well, because they're not going to get this coverage where they're at anytime soon. So we'll bring them in and that way they can get some training as well.'

Joe: What use is that for the local law enforcement who have to mix it in with people from miles away when they're - its' only the local people who are going to be left with the problem when it happens for real, in the moment.

Jason: Well that's the thing, get some training. I mean, come on, some training? I mean this is, like if they were serious it would be like, you know, pull guys in for, you know, an entire month and do a series of exercises and get 'em know each other, and all bunk together and stuff like that. And go around the country with it. I mean, if they were really serious about this there are serious ways of training.

Chris: Well exactly. It's the way that they continually have changed it. Now I've been out of this for, you know, quite a few years now, but even when I was in, this is when there was this - it was basically an integration on most of the military installations - it was an integration with DHS doing these mass exercises, on a military installation and stuff like this. And everything was completely confusing. Once this integration with DHS under this new way of doing training, or scenarios, everything changed drastically. I mean, from one drill to the next you never knew what was going on. They never kept with the same things, they would have some of the weirdest limitations on the exercise in place. An example was is that: 'Okay, you guys, there's casualties, but when there are casualties, don't you guys go in and get them, because there is a unit from the side that's going to go in and get them'. You know what I'm saying? In other words, they're putting limitations on how its going to be reacted to. So you can't react to it, normally. It's confusion.

Jason: You know what your story is reminding me of? The introductory chapter from Ponerology, where he talks about, you know, imagine, the professor comes in. And he's a new professor and he's never been in academia before.

Chris: Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Jason: I mean, as military officers and stuff like that, you're sitting there, and you're training and training or whatever, you're focused on your job and all of the sudden some suit comes in, who is probably appointed for political reasons and he's going to tell you...

Niall: How to do your job.

Jason: How to do your job. And design the curriculum, so to speak, of the new order. And of course he doesn't know anything about it, because he's never been in a crisis. He's doesn't know anything. You know, I mean, this is, what you're talking about, it reminds me of that chapter in Ponerology where he describes the new professor.

Niall: It also reminds me...

Chris: It is very much similar. But you know, most of the guys on the ground, this is my personal opinion, that most civilian agencies, like whoever is doing these drills, you know, in the civilian agencies, it's probably the same thing. Because all of this gets coordinated through DHS in one way or another. This was the new system, you know, back some years ago, they were reintegrating it. And if it happened on American soil, even if it was a military installation, there was a coordination through DHS.

Joe: Mm hm.

Chris: And this whole thing is nothing but utter confusion. Absolutely utter confusion. It's like having, like getting a lot of little children out to play, and then you're just telling them, 'okay, you're going to be this, you're going to be that'. You know what I'm saying? There's no real training in it, you know what I'm saying? And literally we would refer to it as 'going to go play in the sandbox'. This is exactly what it felt like. We were just being told what to do, you know what I mean? It was ridiculous, complete and utter confusion, and totally ridiculous.

And prior to that whenever there was any kind of training, you actually did work with the local law enforcement or the local units that were there. And they would change depending on who was on - what rotation they were on, but, you know, it was - an example: in Fort Lewis you would have to work with Pierce County and Tacoma PD. They would also come in and you would also have a National Guard unit that did your haz-mat and whatnot and stuff like that. So, but after DHS, had this integration through crisis management with DHS, it's - I mean, I hated it, you know? Before it wasn't too bad, but once it happened it was like, 'you gotta be kidding me' because nobody knows what's going on'. I mean you literally don't know what's going on from one minute to the next. And they would say, 'Oh, if you're going to react to something in one way,' they'd say, 'okay, you guys don't do that someone else is going to do something.' You know what I mean?

Joe: Yeah.

Chris: In other words, if the whole goal was let it happen organically and then afterwards getting my after-action report and getting my critique of what I did wrong, or here's what's supposed to happen, here's what did happen, what could be improved, what shouldn't be done, later? But that's not what they would allow to happen. They would just be, you know, 'stop what you're doing, someone else is going to do something. You guys should just go over here and...' nobody knew what was going on. In other words, nothing was done according to reality. It was...

Jason: Can I ask you ...?

Chris: opinion a complete farce. And so when I see what happens in Boston, or, you know, you hear the stuff about the Oklahoma City bombing, apparently there was some sort of drill there, I can definitely see why these things happen. Because nobody knows what the hell is going on! But everyone thinks that everyone who is there is supposed to be there!

Niall: Yeah.

Chris: You know what I mean?

Jason: Well what, what branch of the service were you in?

Chris: Army.

Jason: What was your military operational specialty, or whatever they call it?

Chris: Military police.

Jason: Yeah, so you were like military police?

Chris: Yeah.

Jason: So how did those kind of training scenarios compare to your normal, internal military training scenarios?

Chris: Um, well, military police are a little bit different, depends on what you're doing. The thing is, is when, your basic stuff that you train on as military police is what kind of unit you're on. A line unit or garrison unit. Know what I mean? A lot of people don't know about military police but a line unit, you're going to train a lot of infantry stuff. You will get training on law enforcement, but you're going to go through a rotation. So you're going to go through - you work your law enforcement and you train up for your garrison, you train up for your - then you actually do your field work and you gotta get your stats up, you gotta go through training, all that kind of stuff.

Jason: Right.

Chris: But the point is, that when you do this garrison-type crisis management, you rely on all the skills that you've learned, but the entire way that everything goes down is totally ass-backwards, pardon my French. You know what I mean?

Jason: Right, because the inclusion of the DHS, but my question is kind of like, were the, was the training more structured and better, internally in the military, when you were doing your various training specialties?

Chris: Yes, the military is very top notch training. It's broken down by style, it's made for idiots if you know what I mean.

Jason: Tough standards, right.

Chris: You're going to learn something out of it. It's very good training. You give a task, conditions and standards, They give you a task, here's the condition, here's the standard, and you know, walk, walk, you crawl, walk, run, have it until you get. And you're proficient at it, you're good. This was nothing more than a big play date, if that makes any sense.

Jason: Right. Exactly, which kind of reinforces...

Chris: Rather it doesn't make any sense!

Jason: Right, right. It doesn't make any sense. But that kind of like - actually it does! It totally makes sense. It's what Lobaczewski was talking about, the kind of stuff that happens...

Chris: Right.

Jason: ...when Psychopaths take over. What they do is that they upwardly adjust people who are unskilled, put them into positions of power, and then they go around and all of a sudden they are telling soldiers how to do their job. Here you are, your military operation specialty is, you know, policing, and then some guy from the DHS who is a bureaucrat is going to come in and tell you how to do your job. When I would imagine that the military training would probably be a little bit more optimized and probably much more well-tested than what some douchebag from the DHS decides to come in and say. And that's like the typical thing that Lobaczweski was describing in Political Ponerology, exactly what would happen, and exactly what I think you're saying, did happen, that you noticed. That these people were coming in and basically making, they were just screwing the pooch all over the place. And there was nothing you could do about it.

Chris: I think I can give a better perspective for you, not the complete wrong impression, though you're very accurate, is, there was no one person from the DHS actually giving orders. This is the beauty of it, and why it's - they bring in all these people without a command structure.

Jason: Right.

Chris: There is no accountability.

Jason: Right.

Chris: There's no one person to blame if something goes wrong.

Jason: Right.

Chris: You know what I mean? It's a part of a DHS program of integrating with the DHS, you know, their program or using their, whatever terminology, whatever protocols that they use and so forth. The DHS at that time was used for a coordinator between different law enforcement agencies.

Jason: Right.

Chris: But the reality of it is that there is nobody in charge. Everybody thinks that, everybody who is at the top, at a certain level of the chain of command, thinks that they're in charge. Or not in charge when they're held to be accountable.

Jason: Yeah... I mean that's the kind of...

Chris: It's nothing but a large playdate. There's nothing structured at all!

Jason: Yeah, that's the kind of thing that you expect because there's like a constant revolving door of psychopaths getting in favor and then falling out of favor. So I mean, that's just a really interesting. They're just basically making a big mess of it. The same kind of stuff...

Chris: I read from Gordon Duff, had a, it was either on SOTT or it was on Veteran's Daily, where he had said that, a lot of this type of training and stuff actually came from Israel. I don't know which article it was, but I'm almost positive it was one of the articles on SOTT. It was written by Gordon Duff, and it might have been on PressTV. But anyway, I had actually heard that rumour as well, while I was in.

Jason: Here's the thing. I mean the Israelis right now are kind of like, I don't know, they're, - everyone's like, 'oh I studied Krav Maga, so I must be a badass now.' And yeah, I mean, Krav Maga is kind of good because it took from a couple of good martial arts. Great, fine, whatever. But I mean, the Israeli military is not such badasses. It's not - just because the training program comes from them, doesn't really mean much of anything. I mean, when they go in to deal with 'terrorists' they go in with Apaches, and they've got their whole little fleet of F-16s that we gave them and their missiles and shit like that. Their training programs are not necessarily so super good. But they're buzzworthy!

Chris: No, I mean, you know, absolutely, it's, haha, uuugh the Israelis. I've never done any actual work with them personally. But I have actually talked to a lot of guys who actually have. They're not bad, it's no different than ours. Seriously.

Jason: Yeah, it's a military. Military training is kind of consistent across the board for most first world nations. They all share information, you know what I mean. Personally I think the American military is better, but that's just because I'm an American and...

Joe: I'm going to play America, I'm going to play a clip...

Chris: Well, I can tell you this right now. The Americans, the French, the British, and the Germans are pretty much the same. That's just from personal of training with them. As far as the tougher ones, well the Ukrainians are probably the toughest. These guys wake up in the morning and they drink Vodka for breakfast. So, haha.

Jason: Who did you say were the toughest?

Joe and Niall: The Ukrainians.

Jason: The Ukrainians! Oh yeah dude, the Russians, man, they're pretty infamous in the...

Joe: Chris? How long did you, serve, and when?

Chris: I did eight years from '02 to '09.

Joe: Okay. So it was fairly recent, yeah?

Chris: Yeah, feels like I've been out for a long time now.

All: Yeah.

Chris: Half the time was in a line unit, the other half was in garrison. But, anyway, I just thought I'd bring it up. I see this stuff going on and I can see that a lot of people don't really understand what reality is like whenever you're having these law enforcement terrorism drills. A lot of people don't understand why or how something like this could happen.

Jason: Yeah man, you brought up some pretty interesting points.

Joe: Mm-hm.

Chris: But when I watch, it was like, I know exactly what was going on. I mean, I've been in that predicament. You don't know what's going on! And honestly it's no different than in Iraq. You know, when we were over in Iraq, many times, you've got groups of guys that come in, they're involved in something, you've got to support them in some way, you have no idea who they really are. There's this air of 'I don't even know who these guys are but I'm told that they're important and I have to transport them from point A to point B, and I don't even know why I'm doing it.'

Joe: Follow orders.

Chris: I got to pick them up in the middle of a desert, or some location, you don't really know what's going on. This is how things are being done because prior to - when I came in in 2002, which we're quite a bit 'old-schoolers' switching into the new army, the new way of doing things. The new way of doing things is complete unaccountability. That's the best way I can explain it. Complete unaccountability. You really got to watch your own ass. If someone tells you, you need to get something done, normally you follow an order. If you know that something doesn't sound right, and you know that you may be in trouble for it, you need to go ahead and write an email, parroting that order back to them: 'Oh, sir, I remember you told me X, Y, and Z. I just want to let you know that this may not be a good idea. I'll continue, if you want me to do it, call me back.' So you send him that email, you see what I'm saying.

Jason: Right.

Chris: Then if it's something that you may be accountable for, it's like 'Yeah, I changed my mind, don't do that.'

Jason: Right.

Niall: Yeah. You have to cover your ass.

Chris: There's this culture of not being accountable, giving an order of whatever the case is. And I can't really explain it in a short period of time.

Joe: No, we understand what you're saying though.

Chris: But there's a culture of 'you've really got to watch your ass because there's no accountability up top.' There really isn't.

Jason: This is the kind of stuff that Lobacczewski was describing happens in military...

Niall: It's the way standards start slipping when psychopaths take over. On the one hand, everyone's confused, 'What the hell?' you know, and then they're not actually able to do what they're supposed to do. And then at the same time, with all the confusion that creates, gives the psychopaths their ins, for them to get things done.

Jason: Everyone's so busy, you know, chasing their own tail half the time, that they can't actually stop for a minute and say, 'Hey wait a minute, this guy is actually an asswipe, and he needs to go.'

Chris: Absolutely.

Joe: Yeah, alright, thanks for your call and your experience, sharing your experience there, Chis. That was, that was useful.

Chris: No problem. Thanks for your show and all the work you guys do there at SOTT.

Joe: Alright, thanks. Bye.

Jason: Thanks, man. Take it easy.

Joe: Yeah, I mean, what Chris was just saying there pretty much fits with what we were thinking, which is that, when they have these kinds of drills and these emergency management situations, that it's a free-for-all.

Niall: Far from creating a pinpointed response by practicing it and then in the future we will have a great system in place, just have to say 'go' and everyone knows what to do, it creates a situation where there's chaos.

Joe: There's chaos, but that chaos is perfect for people to work their nefarious ways.

Jason: Right this is terrorism stuff. There are no real terrorists, you know what I mean?

Joe: Yeah absolutely. There are no real terrorists. But getting back Jamar there, our previous caller who brought up the idea that, this startling idea that we'd never heard before...ha, I'm just pretending - the idea that...

Niall: They might be doing all this.

Joe: That there is some kind of - that the whole point to these kind of terror attacks, or terror plot, terror scares, is to condition the people to be more dependent, and look to authority, to be more dependent on and look to authority for protection. And the reason that the powers that be or whatever are doing this, is because there is a cosmic threat out there in the form of fireballs, fire and brimstone, as we've mentioned on previous shows, has increased almost double, year on year, over the past seven or eight years, the amount of fireballs and meteorites in the sky. And we've had the Russian explosion, just, I think is was just last month right?

Niall: February.

Jason: Was it late February?

Niall: February 15. It was actually two months to the day of the Boston Marathon.

Joe: Hang on, you talking about this one? (plays audio clip of the Russian meteorite explosion...booom, sirens, aftershock booms)

Jason: I mean, you couldn't design a better cover than this fake terrorism stuff. Because I have a feeling that there are going to be large pockets of people who are going to be, until the very end, thinking that all the things exploding around them, have to do with terrorist attacks!

Joe: [laughing] Terrorist bombs!

Jason: You know, they're not going to understand, they're going to be like, 'I don't understand, what's happening, why are the terrorists blowing up so many things?'

Joe: You could do a great cartoon on that, you know, like mom and pop America sitting in their home with fireballs blowing up around them, and one of them saying to the other, 'Damn terrorists!'

Jason: [laughing] Terrorista!

Joe: Yeah, so Jamar's reference was the one, and just a couple of days after the Boston Marathon bombings was the explosion of the fertilizer factory near West, Texas, between West and Waco, Texas, that happened, again, very coincidentally around the time of the anniversary of the attack and murder of people in Waco by the ATF and the Oklahoma City bombing. And, you know, we could get into all sorts of theories over that but...

Niall: It actually took place more or less within a few miles, it was really close, to where the compound at Mt. Caramel was, so it was north of Waco, and south, just south of the town of West, which is exactly where Mt. Caramel is located.

Jason: Is Mt. Caramel near Molasses Junction?

All: [Laughter].

Jason: Sorry.

Niall: It was more or less pinpoint to where the Waco compound was.

Joe: Wow. Yeah, so, the thing about it is, is that we have decided based on analysis of the videos, the few videos that are available of that impact, that it was most likely a meteor impact. It was not a fertilizer explosion. And, just for anyone wondering, the reason why it wasn't seen across a wide area is because it was very low cloud cover. So it wouldn't have been seen across a wide area as it came in. And once it broke cloud cover, there would have been a fraction of a second to see it before it hit the ground.

Jason: How many died?

Joe: Fifteen, and...

Jason: So more than the Boston thing?

Joe and Niall: Yeah.

Jason: And why isn't that all over the news? Because isn't it a tragedy...

Joe: Because it wasn't even terrorism.

Jason: Isn't it a tragedy when people die? I mean, just purely mathematics here.

Joe: Mm-hm.

Jason: You know, fifteen people versus, what was it, three?

Joe: Yeah.

Jason: You know?

Joe: Yeah. Well...

Jason: How many homes were destroyed?

Joe: A lot. It was a whole block. A lot of old peoples' homes. Yeah, the thing about it is, interestingly, in 2009 and 2012, in 2009 they were picking up meteor rocks from the area and fields around West, Texas, because there was a meteorite seen over that area. It went down in that area. So a meteorite exploded over West, Texas, three or four years ago and another one was seen over West, Texas, over Waco...

Niall: Six months ago.

Joe: ...last year. So it's not exactly rare. It's happened twice, at least twice before, and probably more given the amount of fireballs there are in the sky. Twice before in that area in the past four years, and now one has most likely hit the ground. And it happens a few days after the Boston bombing and maybe its just a response to the Boston bombing. Maybe if you want to get all spiritual and esoteric here, and you know, weird and stuff, you can say, like, this is God, Allah, Buddha, or the Universe, or whoever, you know, Superman's response to the evil of the Boston bombing, which is a false flag attack on the American people. Here's the cosmos not really...

Jason: JR Dobbs?

Joe: ...not really helping in a way, it's kind of like just blowing them up even more. But it's kind of like, it's killing more of them, but maybe it's a wake up call, you know? To people. Like as I was saying before, the whole idea of false terror attacks is to make people dependent on authority, and to look to them for protection when they can't be protected by authorities from a cosmic threat. And the cosmic threat comes in and says, 'Hi! Don't forget about me! You can do bugger all about this, but I'm going to keep blowing you all up here. Just, FYI!' We got a call here. Hi caller, what's your name and where are you calling from?

Ral: (mumbling) Hi this is Ral from New Jersey.

Joe: Say that again.

Niall: What's your name?

Ral: This is Ral from New Jersey.

Joe: Hey, Ral, how's it going?

Ral: Hey, it's good. Actually I just wanted to rethread the point Chris had mentioned. But how exactly are corporation working standard procedure. Because every corporation does exactly the same thing. They trying to, what they call, export from outside, to re-assist the, any division of the company or any of the procedures. So when these third party companies come, they have only one intention. Nobody knows what is the name of the changes they bring in, but they come up and they tell you some procedures. Now when these procedures are implemented everybody knows that it's going to be crap.

Joe: Mm-hm.

Ral: But the problem is, the whole management culture in U.S. is pretty much bootlicking. So, if a manager doesn't do what he has been told, somebody else will do it.

Joe: Mm-hm.

Ral: So this structure is just like, every layer of the structure is like this. The end result is, nobody knows who benefits from what they're saying. I can tell you one example. I have seen this in areas where literally specific setup groups were removed from the job, from the lowest level to the CEO level. Probably you must be wondering, what is going on.

Joe: Mm hm.

Rao: But the moment they introduced these third-party groups, third-party external companies, and they insert, [pocket-wise pocket-wise](?). And then ultimately they choose what they want to choose. But for a normal person it's completely confusing. You really don't know what's going on.

And they do this pretty easily. Because if you look at LinkedIn. In LinkedIn if each person, they say, actually they claim that, in four or five connections, they connect anybody in the professional group. That means, if they have a simple application like LinkedIn, which is pretty common like Facebook, somebody who has the access, they can usually look at who is connected to what. And if they have the profile of the people, that means who is the handler, what has he written, the person he has joined, when he has gone out, they can easily bundle, these types of processes they are doing.

Rao: It's pretty easy because they have another that's pretty easy, even a common man can use how to apply type of architecture to massive, billions of records they can process pretty easily. So these companies like Pentagon, they have these kinds of applications for applications for more than 50 years at least. And they have everything in their fingertips. And they can hire some scriptwriter and then create these types of things pretty easily.

Joe: Absolutely, that's basically what Chris has been saying and when they bring in these external companies it's for a - it's completely useless. It destroys the system in place, which is based on people knowing their jobs, and doing their jobs well. And they come in with this ridiculous psychopathic, kind of ideology of how to improve things, and it messes everything up.

Niall: It must be so infuriating for people who have built up a knowledge base over years, over decades, and then some twit comes in and says, 'From now on, this is how its going to be.' And this is infuriating, you can't do anything about it, because, well, 'He's my superior. I guess I've got to follow him.'

Jason: I mean, ultimately, it's why psychopathic governments never succeed for very long.

Niall: No!

Jason: They keep eating themselves up because they're fundamentally incompetent, in almost every description of the word, except for fooling people into thinking that they're normal. I mean, they're very good at that, but, you put them in charge of an economy, they'll tank it. You put them in charge of a military, they'll get everybody killed. You know? I mean...

Niall: Great job, Brownie! You remember that one?

Joe: Katrina?

Niall: Yeah, he was the FEMA director.

Joe: Yeah.

Niall: Who absolutely...

Joe: Screwed up.

Jason: Yeah, I mean, so these guys, they're just, they're fundamentally incompetent. And they cause the governments to fail, which is why, Aldous Huxley, I think, said something along the lines of, 'There is no reason why a truly scientific dictatorship should ever be, usurped, or whatever it was or...collapse. It should go on in perpetuity.' But he didn't understand ponerization, and that's basically what happens to all dictatorships. Eventually they fall. I mean, they might last a lifetime of somebody, you know. Kind of like what we saw in the Soviet Union. It eventually crumbled from within, just rotted basically.

Niall: Rao, you're in the States, right?

Rao: New Jersey.

Niall: New Jersey. Well that's not far from Boston. Did you notice, was there any kind of - what was it like for you this week? It's been a crazy week.

Rao: Actually, I didn't listen, actually, I didn't switch on the radio that much. Yeah I didn't really listen to the radio. So I didn't know. But again, it's the same story. The problem is, the entire management structure, whether it is corporate, whether it is private sector, or whether it is government or military: the fundamental thing any manager looks hiring anybody is: whether this guy will listen to me or not. As simple as that. The entire structure, it is so corrupted from top to bottom, nobody looks two levels above him, two levels below him. The only thing they look at it, is (?), who is doing what. That's it. So then you have that type of mindset. You add a mixture of external agency, and you have a software fitting which can clearly see who is doing what, who is begging for whom. Begging means it's not real begging. You go into your lunch room, talk something over it, you get some little clue, and you go and play it back little clue. As long as things go well, keep quiet. When things blow on their face, dump it on somebody. And the drama [inaudible] in every corporation. It's pretty easy, in this type of mindset.

Niall: Ok Rao, thanks for your call. We're going to wrap our show up soon, so we're going to say, take care and thanks for calling in.

Jason: Thanks for calling in, man.

Rao: Ok, bye.

Joe: Have you something to say there, Niall?

Jason: Dunkin' Donuts?

Joe: Yeah, tell us that story. This was just...well...

Niall: Ok, so the manhunt is underway. Friday, Boston is on lockdown. Serious situation, drones overhead.

Jason: With all those police, Dunkin' Donuts made a killing!

Niall: The only businesses that were allowed to open in the whole city were Dunkin' Donuts. [Laughter] I'm not kidding. This is not satire. This headline is not from 'The Onion': "Dunkin' Donuts in certain Boston areas stay open to serve police during city lockdown."

Jason: Oh my God, how cliché is that?

Joe: That's ridiculous. I mean, it's the little ridiculous things that really get you.

Jason: The thing is, that considering what we know about gluten [murmurs, becomes inaudible, then laughter]. I didn't say that! What? Oh no!

Joe: Donuts are great!

Jason: Donuts are great! I think cops should get free donuts. I do.

Niall: Yeah! And free extra-large cappuccinos!

Jason: Yeah! Totally!

Niall: Go for it!

Jason: And maybe even like a Coca Cola or something?

Niall: Aspartame. Aspartame is good, isn't it?

Joe: Diet Coke.

Jason: Yeah, we need to keep them healthy there. Give them some Diet Coke, too.

Joe: Diet Coke, donuts and coffee, all mixed together.

Jason: In a blender.

Joe: Just blend it all up and give 'em like, food bags with tubes in them. And just keep 'em going, you know. Ah, sorry, sorry to policemen who are out there. But you shouldn't be eating donuts. Any good policemen out there. So, this week has been an interesting week.

Niall: Sure has.

Joe: And to sum up what we've been saying, the Boston bombing, Boston marathon bombing, fits the profile of a false flag attack, of which there have been many, with the exception that the vast majority, the dozens that have happened in the last ten years in the U.S., the terror plots, none of them came to fruition. They were stopped, and the terrorists were put in jail; this one was exactly the same, probably followed exactly the same procedure with the exception that they decided to go ahead and allow the bomb to explode. They did exactly the same thing in 1993 with the first World Trade Center bombing. That's on the record, if anybody wants to check. Dan Rather reported on it and said that the FBI had followed the plot all the way along, and had the opportunity to stop it but decided not to because, it wasn't the terrorists who were doing it. It was some faction of the U.S. government or Intel agency's plot all along. That's why it went ahead. And the same thing applies to the Boston marathon. And the sad thing is, is that people died, although Jason might disagree with me.

Jason: That it's sad that they died?

Joe: Yeah.

Jason: I don't know, you know what I mean? In a certain sense, I've kind of run out of sadness for people because so many people die all the time.

Joe: Well, that's one of the points, yeah.

Jason: I've kind of become numb, but not like in normal people, you know? They get numb so they stop caring about people dying. I still care.

Joe: Yeah. But you just can't.

Jason: I have very little 'give a shit' left. You know? Because everybody's dying everywhere. As an empathetic person, I kind of like, it's like, what the hell am I going to do? I can't see this death over here being more important than this death over here. I'm looking, like, well shit, both of them suck. You know, what am I going to do?

Joe: Yeah, I got, given some abuse, like I was saying, on Facebook, over my initial comments on Facebook about the Boston bombing, saying, basically, that this was to be expected and it was going to happen again. But I was talking from a context of my understanding of the broader context, in which it was placed. But the people who were responding to me weren't. They were just having the empathy that was being sucked out of them or elicited from them by the mainstream media. And they just had temporary empathy, with 'Oh, the poor people in Boston.' And I 'shouldn't be saying these things.'

Jason: The thing is, they think that's the way they're supposed to act. They've been conditioned to think that that's what empathy is. Because most of them, probably the people going after you, were probably a little bit psychopathic.

Joe: Well, I hope not.

Jason: You know, I think most of them probably were.

Joe: I think they were the 'average person'.

Jason: Nah...

Joe: You know, it's provoked in them, you know? On a temporary basis.

Jason: Selective empathy?

Joe: Exactly, it's selective empathy, that's what was going on. And I was coming from the same perspective as you, which is I've been looking at this thing everyday and have been for the last ten years, and at some point you just have to step back and take the broad perspective. Because you can't - if you were to go and get invested emotionally in every single death on this planet, you wouldn't be able to operate.

Niall: You'd go crazy.

Joe: You'd go crazy. So you have to step back and you have to try and spread the truth a little bit about what's going on and why its happening to the people who are still listening. I mean, you got to serve, or try and serve, some kind of purpose, some kind of role, otherwise you say nothing. And, I mean, most of these people who are giving me shit about it, were doing nothing. Except when it's provoked in them because of the mainstream media.

Jason: Right, yeah.

Joe: And then they go back to sleep again.

Jason: Fair-weather carers.

Joe: Yeah, exactly.

Jason: They only care when its, you know... they're fashionably sensitive.

Joe: Yeah. Yeah. Everybody else is doing it, so should I.

Jason: We're supposed to be all up in arms about this shit. The thing is, I come from a different era. Not from this era that exists now. I don't understand it, I don't understand people today.

Niall: You mean you're from the future?

Jason: No! I'm from the '90s. I'm from the days of Tupac and 'Fuck the Police' and the 'War on Drugs', and 'the government is evil' and 'Bill Clinton' and all this different stuff. I'm from that era. I'm from the era where you, you know, were harassed constantly by the police and they were giving you tickets for like, skateboarding on the sidewalks and stuff like that. I'm from the time when police were seen as 'pigs' and a 'nuisance' and 'fascists', you know?

And so I don't understand this new world where everybody is getting down on their knees to slob on the knob of every police officer that they meet, you know? I just don't understand it, because I look at them and I see a fascist. Because that's the era that I grew up in. It was all, 'they arrested Tupac, what's going on here' type of thing. You know, so I'm from a different time, where there was no real terrorism, there was none of this stuff, it didn't exist when I was a teenager. I mean, I had never really heard of it. Nobody - until the 19 - what was it, until the first World Trade Center bombing, I didn't even really think about the concept at all.

And so now you have this new world of all these people and I don't understand it, and I can't get involved in it, and I can't feel like, I don't understand these people so I can't really empathize too much with them because I see them as basically like they created their own problem. And for me the government is the one doing it, and then they're getting all weepy eyed and stuff like that, [fake sobbing] 'Oh, this is a terrible tragedy! Oh my god! I couldn't play Angry Birds at night...I have to tweet this!' [Laughter] I don't understand these people, you know? I don't use Facebook, I don't use Twitter. I don't have any emotional or intellectual investment in any of the culture today because it's just not mine. My world ended on September 11th, and that's, you know, whatever.

Joe: I think that's true for a lot of people, most people, pretty much everybody on the planet. Even if they don't know it.

Jason: I'm not too interested in participating in this new world, you know? I just...

Joe: Well, there's not much on offer, you know?

Jason: No, I mean it's really not very fun.

Joe: So, well, we kind of wrapped up already, yep, false flag, Boston. The evidence is there, it fits into a context. Unfortunately...

Niall: One last thing to ponder... Did they choose the date with the anniversary of all these other things in mind? Oklahoma City bombing. Waco. Tax date. Patriot's Day. April 15th.

Joe: How many people were aware of those things? Probably none. People don't know when those anniversaries are, they don't know Patriot's Day. Well maybe a few people do.

Jason: I think maybe those guys are a little superstitious, though, maybe they...

Joe: I think it's an 'in' thing, with them.

Jason: It's like an inside joke.

Joe: Yeah.

Jason: It's April again, time for a fake terror! Hahahaha!

Niall: Yeah.

Joe: Yeah, and it's pretty pathetic thinking about the people behind this. It's so, like I was just ranting the other night to Niall actually about just this, about the idea behind it. It's not even - I'm not even impressed by it. It's so pathetic. What's their ideology? The people who put this together say, 'We want to control people.' Well, okay, why? 'Well, just cause we want to control people, so we're going to blow some up.' It's almost like, okay they're intelligent. That's the thing, there's a contrast there between...they're obviously devious and cunning in an evil way. So they're not stupid. But their ideology is beyond contempt for me, it's like retarded, it's completely retarded. The only thing they want is to control. They look at the planet and they see people and they say, 'We got to control these people. We got to just squeeze them and terrorise them and get them to do stuff that we want them to do.' Well why? 'Just because! Because that's what we want!' It's like, dude, what is wrong with you? You're retarded. Go and get a job, go and get a proper job, and go and live your life. You've only got three score years and ten, what is wrong with you?

Jason: [laughing] Get over it!

Joe: Get over it. I mean... 'Ooooh no, but I wanna control people!'

Jason: Here's the thing. If the world had to be the way that it was, that it is, right? Let's just say, pretend for a moment, let's slice away reality on both sides, and pretend that the world had to be this way, right? I still wouldn't want these fuck retards, for this reason and this reason only: because they are so incompetently inartful at it. You know? I can respect the work of an artist. Alright? Even if they're evil. A totally evil artist I could respect or I could say, well you know what, at least you take pride in your mass murder. I can say, okay, hold on a second here, well at least you're making an effort. But these people aren't even making an effort! I'm terrified to leave the world in their hands because they're so arbitrary and childish and puerile about everything. You know, no one is safe from these people. If they were saying, 'look, it has to be this way, we have to have these fake terrorists,' and then they have these reasons, and they gave a reasoned argument, I would say, at least you thought this through.

Joe: Yeah.

Jason: That's where we can work from because you have some capacity for reason, therefore we can work with this and try to change your mind. But you can't.

Joe: No. It's just mindless ignorance and stupidity and just blind destructive principle. And they're not even - they're like the plague.

Jason: Yeah.

Joe: They need to be avoided like the plague. If you saw somebody like that around, you'd just be like, dig a hole and put that person in it. Quick! Or shoot them into space out of a cannon, quick! You know?

Jason: Into the sun.

Joe: Yeah, into the sun. Because, seriously, and the sad thing is, they have somehow gotten into positions of power over the rest of us. And, although power technically. But the only power they have is to the extent that you actually believe their bullshit and ascribe to their ridiculous notions of control and domination and 'we must control people.'

Jason: From a certain perspective, trying to take over and control the world is really a great undertaking and it's kind of like a manly thing to do!

Joe: If you've got a plan.

Jason: If you've got a plan. It's okay, it's like, at least you've got a plan.

Jason: But with these people and the problem is. Is with America to a certain extent, I wouldn't want to take over the world. The world of today, I would not want to rule it. Like if somebody said, 'Here, you can rule the world,' I'd say, like, 'No thanks.' I mean, these people, these clowns? No! People are just so willfully ignorant some of the times that it does drive me nuts.

Joe: Yeah, willfully ignorant. Obviously, people know already, we've laid it out, what it is. And unfortunately, it's to be expected that its going to happen again. But also keep your eyes in the skies, because there's a lot of stuff happening up there, and it's going to be interesting. So, we hope you can join us again next week. Thanks for listening in this week. We hope you enjoyed it.

Niall: And thanks to all our callers.

Joe: See you same time, next week.