Sott Talk Radio logo
This week on SOTT Talk Radio, hosts Joe Quinn, Harrison Koehli and Niall Bradley discuss the status of the West African Ebola outbreak. No doubt things are bad for people there, but what are the chances of this outbreak spreading to colder climates in North America and Europe? What is or are the best forms of protection we can take against Ebola?

With the heat turning up in the Middle east, we also discussed the twists and turns in 'Pipeline-istan', the ridiculous threats made against Western targets by these mysterious ISIS terrorists. As thousands take to the streets in Hong Kong, are we looking at the democratization of China? Or is there more to the protests than meets the eye?

Running Time: 02:01:00

Download: MP3

Here's the transcript:

Niall: Hello and welcome to another episode of connecting the dots here on SOTT talk radio. I'm Niall Bradley, my co-host as usual, Joe Quinn.

Joe: Hi there!

Niall: And we're joined this week by SOTT editor Harrison Koehli.

Harrison: Hi everybody.

Niall: Oh boy, it's happened! Ebola is in the states. That would have happened sooner or later.

Joe: It was there already. Well it was there when those aid workers were flown back. There were four of them and they supposedly all survived.

Niall: Two of them.

Joe: Yeah there were two of them.

Niall: This thing has got a 50% mortality rate. But actually we suspect it's more like 90%.

Harrison: Yeah, if you look at the past outbreaks of it, Ebola traditionally has an 80-90% mortality rate. There have been some outbreaks where it has been as low as 50%, so that's what they are saying this one is but the statistics seem to suggest it's more around the lines of 85%.

Niall: So not all Ebola's are created equal.

Harrison: No apparently not.

Niall: Okay, i was looking it up; supposedly it was first identified in the late 70's.

Harrison: Yeah 1976.

Niall: And its mutations or variations of the same thing that come around and round?

Harrison: I believe so. I haven't looked into the different strains of it related to the different outbreaks but all of the outbreaks so far have usually been in small rural areas, so this is the first outbreak that has reached a major city. That's why this one is being called as it is; the biggest Ebola outbreak that the world has experienced. Because all the other ones have basically isolated themselves to small rural areas where it just can't spread far enough to have a huge outbreak. There were a few outbreaks that had a couple dozen people to a couple hundred but this is by far the biggest.

Niall: Well, perhaps before we worry about what might happen in the US, what is happening in these cities - in Sierra Leone, Liberia - is frightening. From what we can tell from reports, they've got places under quarantine, entire cities basically; no one in, no one out. That's got to be pretty terrifying.

Is such a situation likely in the US? From officials reactions thus far? No! They don't seem that worried about it. People are asking for some sort of travel ban be put in place from the affected countries in western Africa. But people are - I mean, it's not like online petitions will do anything but they are at least making their voices heard.

The CDC (Centre for Disease Control) in the states responded to that by saying "No that would make the situation worse." Not sure of their logic here, something like, "if we shut ourselves off, if we isolate those other countries, we won't be able to get aid workers in and contain it, it will inevitably spread and spread and reach us in some other way."

Harrison: I guess because of flights going to some other countries which would then come to America.

Joe: Yeah

Harrison: At least that's the rationale. Watching that guy though, he's so glib in all the media appearances I've seen him at. This is the guy who a few days ago was talking about the transmission, there was a little clip with Sanjay Gupta the medical doctor, I can't remember what station he was on, he (the presenter) was saying: "We have nothing to worry about, it's not airborne so you and me right now, (they're standing a couple of feet apart on the screen) if one of us had Ebola, the other one would be perfectly fine, nothing to worry about because it's transmitted by touch only. Bodily fluids." And Gupta says, "I was reading the CDC's protocols on this and they say that it can be dangerous up to 3 feet" and the guys like "oh!" and he's got this huge smile on his face the whole time. He says "Oh, well actually, yeah, 3 feet, we'd probably treat that as a serious situation, we'd definitely want to look into it" He says we would be absolutely, perfectly safe, then 30 seconds later he's saying well actually that would probably be pretty dangerous, we would have to look into that.

Niall: I think the PR he's doing here is to reassure people that it is not airborne. But I remember reading, back in July, accounts from doctors in west Africa saying they've got cases where people are in no direct contact with the camps or with the cities and towns immediately affected. It's popping up there and they were starting to deduce that it must be airborne or some variant of it is. So, he is either not saying what he knows or he is not saying what he doesn't know. I don't know which situation is worse.

You've got a lot of people on alternative media going straight for the jugular here and suggesting that this is some kind of plot. Yes, one of the variants of Ebola was patented by the CDC in 2009, now when they do that they particularly do it with a view to distributing contracts for vaccinations. If there is a plot here then it's sort of out of sync because as far as I can tell there is no vaccination as yet. There was a trial vaccination that they have run out of. There is another trial that they started up two weeks ago. Curiously enough, the company that was awarded it (big pharma here) was Glaxo Smith Kline. They were awarded trials - I'm not sure how it works - or a contract, on the same day that they were fined a half of a billion dollars in China over a massive bribery scandal involving universities and papers and the peer review system there. So there is big money in it but they're not exactly...

Joe: Two years ago the CEO of Glaxo Smith Kline admitted publicly that 50% of their medicines, products, drugs, don't work. The other thing is that there won't be a vaccine against Ebola until a lot of western people get it, because there's too much money in developing the vaccine that has to be put into developing a vaccine for too little return i.e. there's not enough African people that have it yet and they don't know that it's going to spread so they're not going to put any money into a vaccine seriously until it goes pandemic. So you see, you have to wait until many people are in danger of dying from Ebola - we are talking millions - before big pharma will actually act to produce a vaccine because then they would get their money back.

Niall: That makes no sense from the point of view of stopping a pandemic.

Joe: They don't care!

Niall: It makes perfect sense from the point of view of good business.

Joe: Well it is good business! The almighty dollar is what rules the day, everything else is subservient to it. A few million? They probably think "a few million, no loss there".

Niall: They think it will reach France and the UK by the end of this month.

Joe: They have to whip up a bit of fear about the whole thing as well.

Niall: How fearful should people be?

Joe: People shouldn't be fearful.

Niall: It's lethal.

Joe: It is pretty lethal if it spreads, if it's contagious essentially, as in airborne and not just from direct contact. Big pharma operates in the same way as big government operates in that big government makes money from wars so they tend to generate a lot of fear in advance of going to war so that people will support them and so that soldiers will go to war. They have to have a good reason to be scared in to going to war to make money for the military industrial outlets. The same applies to big pharma that they have to have a run up, a precursory period during which they scare everybody with the idea, via the media, that Ebola will go pandemic and then they start to produce their vaccine; then everybody will sign up for it and they get their money.

That's the world we live in people, we are sorry to have to tell you that that's the kind of world we live in and that's the kind of people who make decisions; life and death decisions for most of us, for all of us, but that's the way it is. So you either accept that that's the reality you live in or you stick your head in the sand, and since your down there, you should probably kiss your ass goodbye because sticking your head in the sand is the surest way to find yourself in an early grave, one way or another. If you want to stay alive you've got to keep your head out of the sand, awake and aware and use your brain to figure out what's actually going on and that involves facing the reality of the world in which we live which is a psychopathic reality. A world run by psychopaths; a psychopathic morality having spread down through the tiers of society through the tiers of society, all sorts of business and right across the board, and nobody cares about you. In fact a lot of them actually see you as a cash cow; how can they make money from you? And they are exploiting you; particularly the upper echelons of people in government and various organisations around the world. They all look at ordinary people as things to exploit and get something from and they care nothing about whether or not you live or die, essentially, because there are lots of you. So a few million, even a few hundred million, a billion? What's that? They're useless eaters, well according to Kissinger. He talked about military men right? Didn't he say that about military men? "Dumb stupid animals." I think everyone is a useless eater according to Henry Kissinger. So there you go! Happy Halloween!

Harrison: Scary!!!

Niall: That's the thing about Ebola, it's just another thing. In itself it's not that terrifying because like you have just described it's the psychopathic context in which it is happening that is scary. You've got a lot of people saying that the government's got a patent on it. There's a depopulation agenda, this is all planned. No, but that depopulation could damn well happen just as a consequence of the kind of reality we're living in.

Joe: Yeah, it doesn't have to be a conscious plan. If you have a group of people in power who do not care fundamentally about the lives or the wellbeing or the health of the masses of citizenry, well then eventually and quite quickly they are going to enact laws and pass laws and make decisions for the citizenry that is going to negatively affect the population. Through sheer negligence and thinking only of themselves. It's not hard to imagine, just think of an extremely selfish person, then imagine yourself relying on that person in time of need. You're going to die if you rely on that kind of a person. Those kinds of people are in power around the world making decisions, passing laws; who are in control of the police force and the military and they do not care about you. In that scenario, the people who want to give themselves the best chance of surviving and thriving are the people who recognise that. The people who think that these people care about us, you're walking off the edge of a cliff, you're walking into a trap here, you're blind essentially; you're in the jungle and you're naked, they're going to eat you if you don't realise what's actually going on.

So it's not rocket science. It's just emotionally rocket science, it's not intellectually rocket science but emotionally it's rocket science. Because people have a hard time giving up their beliefs, changing their dearly held beliefs. And, generally, a very strong belief that people have about the world and everything in it, that we're are all the same and generally people are good. And people need to believe that because the reality that we are pointing to here, for which there is abundant evidence on the ground, is not very pleasant, it's scary. It's understandable; people don't want to face a scary, threatening world. They want a nice comfortable, protective society and world. But that's not the way it is, sorry!

It's not me or any of us that are saying it, just look outside, look at what's going on, look at the practices and procedures of people in positions of power and you'll see that it's scary and threatening.

Niall: There's a RT America show called Into The Now, or something, where a journalist goes round with a mike asking people on the streets of New York what they think about the Ebola issue, and about half of them didn't even know what Ebola was.

Joe: (laughing) Ebola what!?! E-bol'a cornflakes?!

Niall: One guy thought it was a band or something. Then this other guy was like "Well, yeah I guess that the government and the powers that be..." and I thought oh wait, this guy might know what he is talking about... "I guess the powers that be are keeping a close eye on it." As in: 'they got this!' "We got you covered!"

Joe: That actually reminds me of someone, it's kind of a joke about Ebola cornflakes. Someone on the web wanted to know what betes was and how do you get it and why was it killing so many people. And what we should do about this threat from betes. And nobody could figure out what the hell this person meant or what it was, and eventually they figured out that she had been hearing of different people with diabetes and that they had 'died of betes'. (laughter) So that's kind of like the Ebola thing.

Niall: Ebola? It's coming to get ya!

Joe: Ebola? Ebola what? What, was there something wrong with his cornflakes? Ebola cereal?

Niall: I saw this blog post: "Don't listen to what the government is saying about it, you've got to look after yourself right! Right on! Ok." and "Make sure you go out and stock up on boxes of surgical masks, protective gloves, gallons of bleach, hand sanitizer, special sealing striping for windows and doors, sanitising clothing, shower frequently, clean your hands" etc. etc. When we say people should be thinking for themselves, should they proactively do something about Ebola in specific? Is it a no brainer or given that it's not a pandemic, and it's extremely likely that right now not that many people in the states are going to contract it, is that in the end part of the same hype about this one threat?

Joe: You mean people having to get surgical masks? Being told to get surgical masks?

Niall: No, not being told to. This is like some blogger saying do that, do this, prep for it, preppers for Ebola. I'm thinking don't prep for Ebola in particular because if we are right, and we probably are, something far worse is coming behind it. The kind of plague, the kind of Ebola that you don't wait 21 days to die from. History shows it's almost instant in some cases.

Joe: People need to be aware that they have been - everybody listening to this show grew up in a society, no matter where you live, where you were encouraged, and your parents were encouraged, to eat food that was fundamentally bad for you. Basically a high carb diet and a very low fat diet, and, depending on your age, it has certainly compromised your immune system; the information now that a high carb diet is bad, particularly for viruses, in that it feeds viruses. And a low fat is extremely bad, because these low fat products are not really food and they are toxic to your body, and that not eating good healthy fats like animal fat is extremely bad for your health as well and conversely eating animal fat is good for your health.

All of this information is available now, so with that information everybody has a responsibility to take responsibility for their own health at this stage, when it has been proven. And there's stacks of evidence to show that the people who have been producing our food and making decisions about what food we should eat and what food is available certainly did not have our best interests at heart and we should never trust them again.

Therefore we should decide ourselves, what we should eat and take responsibility for our own health. And a crucial part of health is obviously what you eat and what you put through your body so at this point, nobody who is listening to this show and nobody who is interested in informing themselves, has an excuse; if and when they come down with some kind of a serious life threatening viral infection. Because there are ways to mitigate that danger through diet and a healthy lifestyle. Also one of the other things is smoking and this is the big one. We have talked about this before; there are several new studies about the beneficial effects of tobacco; there are historical reports about how it was used in the time of the last plague to prevent infection. I think there is a recent report from a few years ago that said there was an element within tobacco leaves that was actually anti-viral. They are also talking about making a vaccine using an element from the tobacco leaf.

Harrison: Is that the Z mapp? This relates back to the two Americans that came back with Ebola and allegedly survived and got healed. The story is that they were given this experimental drug, Z mapp. It's kind of a vaccine; I don't know the exact science behind it. It doesn't work in exactly the same way that a regular vaccine does with the antibodies. It injects something in you after you've already got the disease, a virus, to then kill it or something like that. So these two volunteers were treated with it. There was this whole backstory to this drug. It kind of relates back to what you were saying Joe about them not putting money into this because there hasn't been...

Niall: Because there's no market for it yet.

Harrison: There's not a big enough market yet. That's what some people are saying is the reason why this drug wasn't mass produced beforehand and ready to be there. But the weird thing about it is the guy who first developed this method, what it basically is, is growing these...

Joe: Instead of chicken eggs, which is what they usually use to incubate and grow the vaccine, they use some compound from a tobacco leaf. And it can do it in a few weeks as opposed to six months for a chicken egg.

Harrison: I don't know if the science is right but it's like GMO where they inject the tobacco plant with something and the tobacco plant grows it. So it's not actually a substance that is in the tobacco, it's something that they combine with the tobacco that makes it grow really fast. But the guy that developed this and the company that has been working on this both have ties to organisations that are involved in bio warfare and bio terrorism.

Niall: But the entire sector, including research, is all part of the same structure, so that doesn't necessarily mean it's dubious per say.

Harrison: I'm open to this; there are at least two options: either they didn't fund it just for the reasons Joe was saying out of there being no market for it, or if it is a viable drug and it does work and there is some shady dealing, it could be that they waited for it in order to now push it and make a whole lot of money out of it. Either way it's totally disgusting the way that they operate, just doing it for money. If this drug does work this project should have been funded years ago.

Niall: Yeah, it wasn't. Instead, they are now not sending 3000 troops to West Africa, they are sending 4000. So they say. I don't think they are actually going to send that many; they just keep pumping out the PR because it's what Americans in particular are used to; "Oh, they're sending in the marines." Well, good, we're on top of this".

Joe: They're sending in the marines, that's always a cover unless it's an actual invasion of the country. When they send in the marines on a humanitarian mission, this is theoretically a humanitarian mission, sending in 3 or 4 thousand soldiers; they are just there as body guards for other US government personnel and business personnel. Government/business, there's not much difference. It's a revolving door sort of thing. They are there looking at the situation on the ground and probably, not so much containing it but representing the pharmaceutical companies and their researchers to engage in all sorts of testing and different things with a view to creating a vaccine or something along those lines. The idea of military men - soldiers - going to a place where people are dying of a disease is nonsense really when it's like halfway around the world from your country and yes, there's no specific strategic interest in that area any more than there is anywhere else, to send 3 or 4 thousand troops is just ridiculous. It suggests that they are there as a security force essentially.

Niall: I saw this headline today: "ISIS to attack US with Ebola". Report claims "Jihadists to send infected militants to America to spread disease", say Israeli sources.

Joe: Well, Israeli's are very imaginative with the whole terrorism thing. You have to kudos them on that. Rita Katz for example, is the one who produces the ISIL beheading videos. They are very diligent about it and they do put a lot of work into coming up with scary things about Muslim terrorists. Are they going to fire an infected ISIL terrorist out of a cannon?

Harrison: Ebola rockets.

Joe: It would need to have the infected person in it. Everybody in America, you need to watch the skies; not just for fireballs and stuff but also for bearded jihadis coming down through the sky.

Niall: Bearded jihadis with buboes.

Joe: Yes, with buboes or pustules or plague like infections screaming down through the sky saying "Allahu Akbar" and landing in your neighbourhood and then infecting you all.

Harrison: Well, the Israeli sources actually say that, amongst ISIS and the Syrian rebels, there are Ebola cases breaking out in these groups. Of course there's no actual evidence aside from these Israeli sources saying that but they are saying there are training camps for these terrorists in Africa. That's how the Ebola is getting into Syria and Iraq. It's very shady all around.

Joe: So give me the details on that report. They said that they were going to attack the US with Ebola? That's it?

Harrison: No, I think that they said that it was going to be sent back with American troops, is that it?

Niall: Ahh no. The headline specifically says "Infected Jihadis" will be sent to America to spread the disease. They were short on details.

Joe: Obviously they don't fire them from cannons but if you see a Jihadi, in the street, in any American city, and he tries to hug you or if he's got a sign saying 'free hugs', beware. Because obviously it needs contact to spread, theoretically, so don't hug a Jihadi. I'm going to start a hashtag on twitter. 'Don't hug a Jihadi week'.

Niall: Don't come any closer than three feet.

Joe: Speaking of Rita Katz, this is the woman who has SITE, the group that releases the beheading videos. She had a report after the first one; she was interviewed on fox news or CNN and she was asked how she got these videos. And she got the videos by just having a long history of checking extremist websites and reporting on them etc. She has a very interesting background; she was born in Baghdad to a Jewish family, her father was a spy in Iraq for Israel and he was executed as a spy. She then left and went to Israel and then eventually her husband got a job in the US and she went with him and set up this SITE operation. A very appropriate background for someone who's got it in for Muslims. An Israeli who's got the Muslim terrorism thing between her teeth.

She and her team search the web, the 'dark webs', the 'Jihadi web' or something, where people talk about Jihadi type things, supposedly, and she monitors these and when she sees a video of a beheading - of a which there have been four so far - she grabs it, and she said this explicitly, she takes it and publicises it; releases it. She is essentially a publicist for the head chopper of ISIL; she is their publicist, their marketing manager, because she gets the video and she releases it. And she said explicitly in this video on CNN, she releases it before they are able to. She gets there before them.

So this is propaganda right? In the sense that these beheadings are meant to be propaganda for ISIL. Supposedly that's why they make them right?

Niall: Yeah, to scare the west.

Harrison: That's why they are in English; Jihadi john is speaking in English.

Joe: Yeah, they've got an agenda right? So if we're at war with these people and we want to stamp them out then surely we shouldn't be releasing their propaganda? We shouldn't be facilitating their propaganda.

Niall: That's what they always say, "Oh, we can't talk about the details of this investigation or this plot." because that would aid the terrorists.

Joe: Right, so you don't want to aid the terrorists by disseminating their propaganda so why is it that an Israeli, the daughter of a former Israeli spy, working in the US, releasing ISIL beheading videos before "ISIL themselves", can do that? Shouldn't she just be reporting them then having the website taken down and the video destroyed and making sure it never gets out? Why is she essentially acting as their publicist? Anyone? Anyone?

Harrison: Call in with your guesses and answers.

Niall: The only conclusion is that in order to heighten the ISIL terror threat. It's in order to give the western politicians, and the western media, the substance they need on which to build the case, the dodgy dossiers for invading Middle Eastern countries and controlling their resources.

Joe: Someone just said it, I think she writes their copy as well.

Niall: Yeah, probably.

Joe: She's off camera there with Jihadi John prompting him. She's got flash cards actually behind the camera. Cards she's holding up with the script and he's reading them.

Niall: Somebody did an analysis and said the videos were being made in Israel in some studio. Did they just pull that out of their rear end or - probably.

Joe: With technologies today it could be made anywhere, literally anywhere.

Niall: So there was another one this week, a British guy.

Joe: The whole thing - what you just said - is just obviously the case; it's being used to scare western populations into backing 'Middle East war part III'; this time it's personal, because of these beheadings. I was thinking from a conspiracy point of view, ISIL and the US are working together because both of them want to get rid of Assad. So they had a meeting in Washington - Jihadi John and his friends - came to Washington for a super-secret meeting.

Niall: (In a London accent) "Awight mate!"

Joe: (In a London accent) "it's a war innit?"And they agreed that ISIL would release the videos in order to provide the US, the Anglo-American empire, with a justification to attack ISIL. "So we'll release these videos right? You use it as justification to attack us because we're so evil for beheading westerners. And then you come in and you say you're going to attack us; you bomb Syria and find some way to angle it to bomb actual Syrian government targets and we both get what we want!"

Niall: That makes sense. Except for the fact, I don't know, I suppose they are hitting locations where some of these Jihadi Johns are based, but there are also reports that they are hitting targets and there's not a single terrorist in sight.

Harrison: There's a report from CNN, their correspondent Arwa Damon, and he said that, on the ground, he had information, I don't know where this information was from, but that he had information that ISIL had been tipped off about these air strikes and that they were nowhere to be found. And you've got them bombing grain silos and oil refineries. The oil refineries is a funny one; ISIL has taken over several oil refineries in east Syria and has been basically selling this oil on the black market; making allegedly millions or billions of dollars from it. Now allegedly the Syrian army was set, ready to take back one of these oil refineries and then one of the US airstrikes just happens to take it out.

Joe: I don't believe my theory there obviously, it's silly rhetoric because that's not how they operate. They have operated that way in the past but this situation is different. They have operated that way in the past in terms of the Taliban. in Afghanistan. where they actually funded them, 'our freedom fighters', and Zbigniew Brzezinski was there telling them that they were doing God's work etc. etc. So they have struck a deal with some people but not in a manipulative, covert operation kind of a way as i described.

It's more likely that they are simply being used. They have been funded and trained for quite a long time and now they are simply no longer useful so they are being used as an excuse. They may be being bombed here and there but they are not the target; the target is Syria. But this ISIL group also served a purpose in terms of getting the gulf monarchies on its side. Because while the gulf monarchies are involved in funding and arming these people, I don't think they control them. I think they have their people in places and the decision making echelon of ISIL, however it is...

Niall: However it's structured.

Joe: However it's structured. So they are being used as a threat to get gulf monarchies directly involved in taking action against Syria and keeping the Middle East or south east Eurasia, as it should be called, keeping the Middle East for the Americans and structuring it in a certain way that the Americans may take control of them. You will notice that last year, when the US wanted to bomb Syria on that trumped up charge of chemical weapons, the gulf monarchies weren't up for taking any direct action.

Niall: But the Saudis were livid that direct action didn't result from it.

Joe: Exactly but they don't want to be involved themselves. The Saudis are despicable characters, the Saudi monarchy and all other gulf monarchies are just quite despicable individuals. They have no ideology that they hold to, they have no morality. They just have interests in their own positions and maintaining them. They want the US to do all the fighting and bombing for them and they never want to take direct action because they are scared of their future in the middle east, because they don't know where it's going to go down the line. They want to secure their monarchies and their privileged positions for a long time to come.

And they realise that it's a dicey situation messing with these countries in the Middle East because they could come under attack or threat. There's a balance of power there that they're betting on, not to be overtly aggressive, as in taking a direct role in bombing or attacking another gulf state or middle eastern country, because the US will do that for them. And Israel is meant to do that for them. But in this case it seems that the US has used ISIL as a potential threat to gulf monarchies, as in 'these guys could easily just cross over', I mean how hard would it be to take out Qatar or Bahrain or Kuwait? Or even Saudi Arabia? It wouldn't be hard for a bunch of these guys to run in there and you've got a regime change in Saudi Arabia! You've got to realise that everybody knows, particularly in this region of the world, that the US is in the regime change business. So the first question, when you're obsessed by power is: "Am I next? How do I know I'm not next? Can I trust these people? No! I'm not even trustworthy so how can they be trustworthy?"

That's what they say, so there is a lot of suspicion and mistrust there. So ISIL is used as a threat in the background. That the US isn't saying it explicitly but it is implied that these guys could go anywhere, i.e. "You get on board" And what's the external threat? What is the US afraid of in the Middle East? The US is afraid of Russia in the Middle East. It's afraid of Russia and Iran and Syria. And these monarchies are the playing card or the lynch pin to the whole thing. If any of them turned against the US, the Anglo-American empire, and sided with a Eurasian union, it would be all over for the Anglo-Americans. So these people have to be kept in check and there is a diplomatic war going on between these gulf monarchies and the US, and at the same time, Russia and Iran and China are making their moves and establishing themselves. Russia has been establishing itself in the Middle East increasingly over the past few years; striking oil deals with Iran, Iraq, Egypt and Syria obviously; and selling a lot of weapons to these countries. So the US sees this as a significant, serious threat to its power in the Middle East. Nobody can trust anybody there, it's a really dirty game going on and the US has everything to lose and it's desperate and in those conditions, that's when you get something like ISIL being used as a warning.

Niall: As a roaming big stick.

Joe: As a big stick, yeah.

Niall: It's like whack-a-mole, "we could whack you next! It may be you!"

Joe: Because the Saudis are these people who are pretty corrupt and evil but they're not stupid and they don't care who the global mafia boss is. If they see the tide turning and ultimately down the line, you're going to have a Eurasian centre of power with Russia and China at the centre of it. And remember that America is 7000 miles away; the Middle East is Russia's backyard. So a lot of paranoia, a lot of fear and as has been discussed before, a general feeling amongst these psychopaths in power of something happening. It's not that they recognise it specifically but with all of the stuff going on on the planet, with all of the other threats that are coming down the line in terms of increased meteorites, increased geologic activity, increasing storms, upsets of changing weather patterns, all of that is like a dog at their heels or a devil on their back that is scaring them and pushing them. It provokes in them a kind of ill defined, amorphous pressure or fear, simply, "we've got to do something here! We're losing control here! We're losing grip, everything's going to hell! We need to grab as much as we can before it all falls apart!" That leads to increasingly insane policies.

Niall: With each move they lose, they lose more control it seems. This week two initiatives coming out of the Eurasia pipeline: one is the leader of Kazakhstan trying to set up a free trade zone for all the countries around the Caspian; Russia of course, Uzbekistan, Iran to the south and then up, Azerbaijan; Azerbaijan is a small player but it is loaded with oil. This is what Greg Palast called it the "Republic of British Petroleum's thiefdom in the Caspian". I mean, when they hear that kind of thing they start to go, "Ok send in some terrorists. Do something". Another initiative from Iran this week - you might have noticed over the past few years the hysteria about Iran's secret weapons programme was turned all the way down to nearly zero. At one point it looked like some kind of invasion or something major was happening in Iran or something was on the cards, but now Iran is 'our buddy' in the Middle East. Ostensibly because they now have a "moderate leader" as opposed to the last guy, who was also a fairly sane guy too but he was easy to portray as a madman. But that's not the real reason, the reason why they have calmed things down is because of the shifting balance of power in the Middle East means that one of the games, as described by Pepe Escobar, that they are trying is to have Iranian gas and oil supply Europe and become the dominant supply over Russia. So they want to drive a wedge between Russia and Iran, big time. There was just the subtlest of statements from Iran this week about that. Rouhani, their president, saying "Yeah, it's an interesting idea but Iran's infrastructure is not quite ready to replace Russian gas supplies to the EU." i.e. No. That's his 'no' I think. At least that's his way of saying "Well, we'll think about it".

Joe: Obviously that pipeline will come from Iran through Syria? Or maybe under the Caspian?

Niall: I think it involves the Caspian and Turkey, possibly Syria, I'm not sure.

Joe: There was a plan for an Iran, Iraq, and Syria pipeline going to Europe. That plays a major part in everything that's going on in the Middle East

Niall: Yeah but they want that nixed big time because the end terminal in the Med, where that gas comes out, will be Russian. That's the thing they started world war one over; preventing the Germans from having the gas and oil terminal in Basra, Kuwait; that the Brits ended up getting. Then the Americans. It's the very thing that massive wars are started over. That is one of the things that they would definitely not want to happen.

Back to Syria; is Assad friend or foe?

Joe: To who?

Niall: To the Americans, to the Neocons.

Joe: To them? Well, he's a foe because he is aligned with Iran and Russia.

Niall: Ok, now Biden said something odd this week. He explained to the public for the first time exactly how it works in the Middle East; with one major omission of course. He said, "Where did ISIL come from? Who trained and got material from our allies in the Middle East?" and he named them: Saudi Arabia, Turkey and the gulf monarchies. The omission being the US support. What is going on there? The Turks are like, "What are you saying? Shut up!" and they demanded a public apology, which they have since got from Joe Biden. Why is he out of that? Why saying the truth once?

Joe: Well, that's not really the full truth. I mean he's trying to blame them and it follows on from what I was saying earlier on, things are very uncertain in the Middle East. Particularly with a resurgent Russia and the efforts Russia has been making over the past few years to court Middle Eastern and Arab country relations and business deals etc. Like I said ISIL is seen as a potential threat to these gulf monarchies and also Turkey, because Syria - they are right on Turkey's boarder. So nobody trusts America and its proxy armies and they are very right not to trust them.

And for me Biden's comments are just an example of that, and the fact that there is a kind of falling out. But this has happened before; none of them do trust each other but they manage to get along. But that has always been in the context of there being no other option. Increasingly as the days roll by, there is increasingly another option which are these various alliances that Russia is setting up; the one you just mentioned, BRICS and stuff. The whole geopolitical map is changing in terms of the power structure and there is a pivot alright but it's not the Americans pivoting. The Americans are pivoting to the centre, to Eurasia, but the only reason they are doing that is because Eurasia have already pivoted in the opposite direction and the Americans are trying to take action to stop that momentum.

It's obvious that this would happen ultimately, the only thing that was missing was Russia in a position with the intent and the will to assert itself. A natural order is developing and this isn't a result of aggression by Russia, despite what everybody's been saying; or anybody else. This is a result of a natural order of Russia coming into its own and naturally expressing its desires and its intentions and putting money and effort behind those to make them a reality and it's natural and people eventually come to realise that that's the way it is because of the geography of the planet. A country like America that is 7000 miles away; it's unnatural that it would control most of the landmass of the planet and prevent the countries on that landmass from actually controlling themselves. It doesn't work anymore and people are waking up and there is a realpolitik coming into it. But it's good.

Niall: I think they are going to try and, well try or it's going to happen as a result of what's already been set off; they are going to try and spread this ISIL wildfire as far as they can. A couple of reports this week: "Pakistani Taliban pledges support to ISIS as coordinated west haters gains momentum". Another one in Bangladesh; "A British ISIS recruiter arrested in Bangladesh". I mean they've got to have agents all over the place right now going, "Get this stoked up, let's get this going everywhere".

Harrison: We will have to see how this plays out but it's also a possibility - I think it was just today there was a suicide bomber in Chechnya; 5 dead, 10 to 12 wounded. Of course Chechnya was kind of like the Syria of its day, 10 to 20 years ago. With Islamic groups funded and supported by Jihadis coming from all over from these same countries that we see going into Syria. There hasn't been a "terrorist attack" in Chechnya in the last year, but we have this one suicide bomber that happens right now. This guy was going into a theatre and he set off the metal detector or something, so the police took him aside to look at him and he set off these explosives and killed himself and I think 4 police officers and wounded these 10 to 12 people. So we will see. It's looking like ISIS might make an intrusion into Chechnya. That was always a fear.

Joe: Well that's all they've got left and it's too late. It's pathetic at this stage. They've used that tactic too often. Maybe the average person in the street won't understand it but certainly governments in the region understand it and know what's going on. And like I said, they will be less likely to bow down and accept that kind of manipulation and threat when there is another option, when there is another power in the region that can say "Listen, it doesn't have to be this way anymore and we can all still be rich without the manipulations". It's a whole end of empire thing, you can't control it forever. You can't control the whole world from a centre of power that's thousands and thousands of miles away from where you need to be to control everything. Because there are people there and governments there that are eventually going to get tired of that. Russia has done a really good job.

You need to look at a map of the world - a lot - because the people who are planning and carrying out all these manoeuvres all look at maps all the time obviously. Russia are obviously establishing connections in the Middle East. The US wanted an oil pipeline from Baku in the Caspian sea, through Azerbaijan and then through Turkey and over to Europe. And as you just said a little while ago, the US has struck this deal for fishing rights in the Caspian sea, or each country around the Caspian sea which is Russia, Turkmenistan, Iran and Azerbaijan, who all agreed on where their territorial waters were in the Caspian.

So these relationships between Russia and countries that the US had previously courted to try and maintain its control of the oil supply is a serious threat and Russia is just saying "Listen, you're our neighbour, let's work something out here". And the US is kicking and screaming from 7000 miles away or on their aircraft carrier in the Mediterranean. They are screaming about the whole thing and there is nothing they can do about it because the facts on the ground argue against everything that the US wants to do.

Then, like I said, if you come down to the middle east, preventing them from having a regime change in Syria, keeping Assad in power because he's aligned with Russia, courting Iraq; Russia just re-started a $4.2 billion arms deal with Iraq. They have a $3 billion arms deal with Egypt.

That's diplomatic essentially, you make money from it as well. But that's all diplomatic, that's establishing - because once you sell a bunch of weapons, there is an ongoing relationship required to maintain them and to get spare parts. It's like being a trading partner, even if it's weapons. That forces the country in the Middle East that buys those weapons to now have an investment in Russia.

So, bit by bit, you turn them all around and the massive advantage that Russia has is that, as I said, all these countries are in Russia's back yard, they are all right there. And Russia is using the business cooperation angle and has done that mostly but, not that it would ever use it, at the same time everyone is aware that Russia is an increasingly powerful military power. Russia never flaunts that or uses it as a manipulation but it's there in the background and everybody knows about it. All Russia wants to do is to do business. It wants to do business with its neighbours. America wants to stop business; America, as a capitalist country, the free market and all that, it's doing everything to stop free market economics as far as Russia's concerned; in the most natural way, which is with the countries closest to it.

Niall: Yeah well, free market economics was only ever skin deep. Entire US economies were built around the pentagon, the military industrial complex and so on. Their response to Russia, the only thing they can do, is send aircraft carriers into their regions. This week, I think, they announced they are going to start sending tanks to the Baltic States. The obvious implication to those countries being, "You are about to be invaded", rolled over by Russian tanks.

Joe: its nonsense, they'll rust and they'll rot and that'll be the end of it. It's all bullshit. It's so pathetic for European countries, particularly eastern European countries like Poland and.... mainly Poland actually (laughter). Sorry to rag on the Poles. Obviously the Ukrainians as well. It's so pathetic that the leaders of these countries who are meant to know better are falling for that kind of fear mongering. They are essentially manipulating eastern European countries with a version of the Muslim terrorist threat, except it's the Russian terrorist threat. It's the soviet-commie terrorist threat, and they are falling for it. It's ridiculous!

Niall: Not one single journalist in the west, in any corporate press anyway, not once since March this year has questioned the naming of this civil war in Ukraine as an anti-terrorist operation. From the get go they said the whole swathe of people were terrorists and fell into line with that. That is frightening, over a decade of 9/11, Muslims and all that propaganda, you could sort of see how they would fall for Muslim terrorists but from the get go, bang! Half of Ukraine are terrorists because they have an affinity with the Russians who are the ultimate terrorists.

Joe: I don't think that challenges the power of the state. That's why people in positions of power in European countries would go with that because they always see anything that challenges their positions of power, any people, regardless of whether they are Muslim or whatever, ultimately are terrorists who try to change the established order. Even if that's just breaking away or demanding independence. I wouldn't be surprised if the Spanish government started calling Catalonians terrorists.

If you want to break away and become independent and the state uses strong arm tactics and sends in the police and starts beating heads and stuff, and out of that you have got ordinary people who have got their heads beaten or have got their family members killed then, you meet force with force, they're terrorists. But that's nonsense, it's ridiculous, it's pure bullshit propaganda, it's completely illogical essentially. There is no relationship to reality and that's been true across the planet for hundreds of years, except that the US in recent years has attempted to actually create a reality around that idea. A false idea that ordinary people fighting over justified grievances and for their rights etc.
They have tried to create their reality of those people being terrorists and they have done it the only way they could do it which is controlling and operating those individuals themselves and making them act like terrorists. i.e. Nihilistic, I just want to kill people because I hate them. But that never existed, so they had to create it amongst them.

Niall: Complete fake cause; fake ideology complete with a banner, logo, PR department; Rita Katz.

Joe: Yeah but their ideology comes down to - they can't even come up with a proper ideology because then they would have to allow for something that made sense. These people are fighting for their independence and for their rights etc., so they ascribe to these fake groups, that they create, they ascribe to nihilistic ideologies which is: "We are going to kill people because we hate them" It's a very basic thing, "He's not the same religion as me therefore I am going to kill him".

But the modern history of the planet shows that generally other people don't have a problem with other people being religious or of a different religion or non-religious. It's only a few psychopathic elements amongst society, particularly in positions of power, that have a problem with that but they nearly always use it, not because they genuinely don't like another religion but they are using it to accrue power to themselves or put themselves in a position of power where they can control other people.

Ordinary people left to their own devices would have no problem with any aspect of the expression of normal humanity. Why would anybody ever have a problem with normal expression of normal humanity in any form? They don't, they wouldn't, they never have and they never will. It's only psychopaths in power who use those differences to gain power for themselves.

Niall: But there is a sizeable chunk in any given population that actually goes in with the swastikas and the torture devices and gleefully carries out the brutality on the ground. I mean they're not ever going to be in power anywhere.

Joe: No, but they're just tools and they have been used. By and large if they're not psychopaths themselves which most of them probably aren't, the thing that makes any normal human being act in that way where they go and attack and kill other people is because they're being programmed with a fear based ideology by someone above them. By a psychopath in a position of power who uses those people and whips them up into a frenzy and makes them afraid. Fear is the only thing; fear of the other, generating or engendering fear of the other in a person is what would make them attack another person. But left to their own devices, no normal person would ever come to that conclusion; that they should be deathly afraid of another human being simply because he is doing something different from me. The natural human inclination is to be interested in something that's different and human differences are not threatening in and of themselves but people can be whipped up into a state of fear by all sorts of lies and manipulations and that's what psychopaths in power do.

It's fairly simple and the problem is psychopaths are in positions of power and the fact that psychopathy exists as an abhorrent or deviant variation of human nature or of human psychology. It's effectively not human because it's a distortion or a genetic abnormality that, as hard as it might seem, should be removed from the gene pool because it's destructive to the entire population, to the entire species. It's destructive so you remove it; people with cancer get tumours cut out because if they don't it'll spread and infect and kill the body. People don't have a problem with removing cancer. Psychopaths are essentially the same as cancer on humanity and applying medical practices, they should be removed for the good of the vast majority of human beings. Obviously it's not practicable to do that, you have to live with it and learn from it and whatever the actual goal of it is because...

Niall: Not least because so many of them don't ever get to those high positions. They serve some useful function at some point along the line but they are far too successful in the sense that, not only do they never actually produce some of the horrific violence themselves, or instigate it, they can live such apparently normal lives and never be involved directly in the torture or murder of other people. There are all sorts of other ways in which they are destructive.

Joe: Yeah, interpersonally.

Niall: Or as a lecturer or a writer.

Joe: And they spread an ideology as well. If they even just become, not captains of industry, but if they hit on a good idea that is anti-human or conscienceless and they spread that meme. I can't think of any ideas right now but people that just promote conscienceless practices amongst society; how they look at other people and just their view of other people. And that's the other thing. It's one thing to say that they are an aberration and that they shouldn't exist in human society but clearly the ideology that they espouse does take hold in normal people so there is an anchor in a normal human being for a psychopathic view of reality. So we can't wash our hands of it completely because there does seem to be some element within normal humanity that can resonate with a psychopathic view which is essentially a conscienceless, extremely, supremely selfish view.

Niall: Of course it must have been attractive enough to people to have been with us this long and to have been unseen this long. That is the only way it can have infected so many people to some degree or another because we quite like having it around.

Harrison: But at the same time it's not like it's an incurable disease. Joe you were mentioning about how humans are by nature curious and you'll often see this in college students that finally try to travel and go round the world and they realise, "oh hey, wow, there's a whole world out there, it's amazing and look at these people!" And you might go to a country that you might have preconceptions about and think it's going to be a certain way but then lo and behold, look! You find people that you get along with and "hey, they're just like everyone else", they just live in a different culture.

So there is this psychopathic ideology that says and kind of ingrains in people that these people are other and that they're fearful of the 'other'. Either they're terrorists or they're weird or they're the kind of people that you would want to turn their country into a glass parking lot; then you actually go there and you meet them and it kind of defuses the whole thing. So really the solution is knowledge; it's like when you expand your horizons and you actually learn something about what's actually going on, that knowledge cleanses you of this nasty ideology. And so yeah this cancer has been with us for so long but now the information is available for people to look at. And it's just a matter of presenting it, because without that it's just going to continue the way it's been going for thousands of years.

Joe: I just wanted to add that, what's engendered in people, that fear of the other as the monstrous, barbaric beheader and remorseless, conscienceless killer; that's how many people in the west see Muslims and Muslim terrorists. That's actually a bit of a stupendous manoeuvre because it's the psychopaths in power that have engendered that in people by presenting that image to them and in that way them have distracted the attention that should be on themselves because those ideals that they project on to other people and tell other people about the other that is monstrous, that's who they are!

Harrison: Exactly

Joe: So people shouldn't be naturally be terrified of Muslim terrorists, they should be naturally terrified of psychopaths in power because that's their nature. If you look at Muslim terrorists, the head chopper, the killer and all that kind of stuff, that's your senator, that's your president, that's your captain of industry; that's what's inside him.

Niall: That's your John McCain, that's your Bernard Henry Levi, that's why they go to these places. It's almost like a gathering. There's an understanding when McCain meets these people. They have an understanding and he will tell you as such.

Your description there of how Russia one by one turns countries on the Eurasian landmass just by the natural order of things, business deals, military deals and so on; I've been thinking about the situation in Europe and I was hopeful for a while and now forget it. The cancer in Western Europe is too far gone. I do not see France, Germany and Italy, never mind the UK, being turned; even against their own wishes, you know reluctantly diffusing the situation, even for their own good if nothing else. The Germans are talking about sending troops to eastern Ukraine, the French elites are obviously completely untrustworthy and I think they will go down with the rest of the ship; the USS Empire.

Joe: The Titanic. Talking about vice president Biden, he said just this week that he had to embarrass European Union countries into taking action against Russia into imposing these sanctions. He didn't say how he embarrassed them. Maybe embarrass is a euphemism for threaten but he said that the US had to embarrass them into doing it. Which suggests reluctance on their part, which is natural reluctance because Russia is lurking right in their back yard and was a very important trading partner etc. And somehow Biden was able to embarrass European politicians enough to get them to shoot themselves in the foot, to cut off their nose to spite their face basically; imposing these sanctions on Russia. So I don't know exactly what he did, does he mean he got the CIA to pull out some...

Harrison: Photographs.

Joe: Some compromising pictures of Angela Merkel or something? Not that I want to see those because it would embarrass me but maybe? They've done it before, maybe they took a lesson from the Israelis who are known for using that kind of a tactic to influence people.

Niall: They have Angela Merkel's personal phone records.

Joe: Yeah exactly, maybe he was being very candid there in the fact that they literally did embarrass/threaten them with exposure of some kind of in flagrante activities. But that's going to work against them ultimately as well because that's not a very friendly thing to do and at the first opportunity you would think that the people who you treated that way would take the opportunity to give back what they got.

Niall: Give Washington the middle finger. Well it remains to be seen, I don't have much hope.

Joe: No, I don't have much hope either but you know what? Russia is going to carry on with what it's doing and ultimately, this whole ISIS/ISIL business in the middle east, it's all going to go nowhere; Assad is going to stay in power; Iraq is going to eventually go its own way as well; Iran is not going anywhere; Saudi Arabia and the gulf monarchies, i think will all give it a while and they will all see the facts on the ground and the US would be left with America and some western European countries. If you include BRICS here, we're talking about: Brazil, Russia, India, China and South Africa. China is all over Africa, so really if you look at the line of force here and the movement of the way things are going, the US is on its own, ultimately, and any western European countries foolish enough to not see the writing on the wall can go down with it. The vast majority of the landmass of this planet is Eurasia and it's in the process of becoming more aligned with many other major landmasses, south America for example and ultimately Africa and India; a sixth of the world's population.

Niall: 80% of the world's population are in Eurasia.

Joe: Exactly.

Niall: And their resources.

Joe: So it's not looking good and it's the last gasp, desperate efforts that we are seeing here. When they go to the extent of funding this ISIL proxy army and have them chop off heads and have some Israeli spy release the video and even admit to it on the internet; you can't go much lower, there's not much more you can pull out of the bag.

Niall: You kind of can't because while you're doing that, hyping up by creating some facts on the ground - so yeah, you've got some heads rolling and some atrocities being committed by your terrorists in the middle east to give it some legs, to give it some reality. It's happening to thousands of people in another country that's getting zero media attention. In Ukraine they are covering mass graves at this point, where people have been tortured; their hands tied behind their back and shot dead.

Harrison: Pregnant women, another woman with her head cut off. (Sighs) Last week has seen some more shellings in Donetsk. They shelled the Red Cross headquarters in Donetsk; they killed the deputy head of the mission there.

Joe: Shades of Israel.

Harrison: Yeah exactly. They bombed a school on the first day of school; an elementary school. Thankfully no children were killed but I think they killed 2 adults and at the same time they bombed a residential street nearby and killed, I think 11 people. And yet, the only thing the western media will say about this is "Oh look, Sergey Lavrov the foreign minister said that they found 400 bodies in these mass graves." Well it turns out that Lavrov was wrong, the source for this says there were 400 unidentified dead bodies in the morgue and it looks like Lavrov had made the connection that those were from the mass grave. It turns out they weren't from the mass graves. But there's no acknowledgement that these mass graves were there, that these people were tortured and murdered by the very people that the US government has put in power and is supporting. No, they just say "Oh look, the Russians are up to their propaganda games again".

Niall: The BBC did something similar, there was a photo from the MH17 crash site showing a row of bodies or something and that had been used in an article about the mass graves and it said "Ah! You see! The Russians are crafting propaganda" therefore it's not true.

Harrison: As if these bodies don't exist. You can see there are pictures of them, it's not like they are making this up.

Joe: I don't know. The western media, the BBC, the Anglo-American empire in particular, they are the evil empire. They are pure, unadulterated evil. Not that other people in other countries around the world aren't evil but these ones are leading the field and have been for quite a long time in pure evil. And their media, such yellow pusillanimous journalism, I have nothing but contempt for every employee of the BBC because any of them that are left, they have sold their souls and they are liars, manipulators and effectively facilitators of crimes against humanity. But they call themselves journalists. No. You are a despicable excuse for a human being. How they even call themselves journalists, it's ridiculous. It's like ideology but it's some bullshit western, Anglo-American ideology over dead children? I'm swearing here.

Niall: They don't even see the ideology, this is the thing. It's like being born into a vat of lies; you swim in it, you breathe it, you live in it, you eat it, you don't know anything else.

Joe: Well if dead children don't shake you out of it or don't make you question what you are saying, and you read back to yourself what you wrote and what you wrote is essentially justifying the murder of those children? Well I'm sorry, you're not human, you're a despicable piece of gum and you don't deserve to...

Niall: It extends beyond the media. Amnesty international, that bastion of "Human rights! Human rights"! They just bleat about human rights but it is amazing how they have not said a single word. A top lawyer in Kiev, I think he was the guy who was dumped at a dumpster after getting a beating - no one said jack about that. And he wasn't like a partisan Russian supporter or anything. Or that other story, the horrific one about the police chief in Donetsk.

Harrison: Yeah, I'm still looking into that.

Niall: They got a video of it, ISIS style, but it was for real and they showed the guy being beheaded while his wife was tortured next to him.

Harrison: Well they show, not him actually being beheaded but they show his neck being slit and him bleeding out while - now I haven't been able to totally verify who these people are; now allegedly this is the Donetsk police chief in April being killed in a hotel or a bedroom of some sort. He is on the floor; there are three or four guys in military fatigues holding him next to the side of the bed. There is one guy holding a woman, presumably this guys wife, on the bed, her face down, him on top of her holding her down while they cut his throat. This guy has got saran wrap kind of plastic round his mouth and they hold his neck back, slit his throat and they video tape the whole thing.

Niall: These are right sector thugs.

Joe: These are the people that the US directly finance through their NGO's. These are the people that Victoria Nuland, the deputy secretary of the US state department, was cheerleading. And there you go; I said it's the evil empire, that they are a despicable bunch of psychopaths and that's the evidence for you. Just because they are not directly involved in it themselves - it actually makes it worse to a certain extent. That they are supporting and funding and facilitating that kind of behaviour and then crowing about 'freedom and democracy'.

Niall: The good news is that freedom and democracy is spreading to China.

Harrison: Yes, Hong Kong

Niall: "Yay!" Ah, wait a minute. This is the pivot to China that Obama was talking about. This is the form it comes in. None of this "Oh, diplomacy and trade deals" because they know they can't compete with Russia; they know they can't come close to it so this is how they answer it. These protests have actually been going on more or less nonstop since Hong Kong was handed back, partially, to China from the UK, Britain, in 1997, so it had not just come out of the blue. The only thing that's different in the last two weeks since it flared up this time is the attention they give it. They have CNN crews on standby, obviously aware that these protests were about to happen. Reporting it like "Oh, here come the riot police! Oh, the tear gas, the violence! Look at that! Look at the brutal, evil, tyrannical Chinese state! Who would dare treat their own citizens like that?" and I was just thinking, a month ago! A month ago we had Ferguson Missouri riots and CNN reported that like 'looters, looters everywhere, terrible terrible stuff, terrible stuff'.

Harrison: How many thousands arrested at occupy in New York right?

Niall: New York, Los Angeles, San Francisco, Chicago, Miami, everywhere! 48 cities across the US and now it happens a little bit in Hong Kong and it's like, "Oh my God! This is wonderful, this is freedom and democracy finally coming to the Chinese people".

Joe: What are they going to do? Again it's a last gasp effort to do something and that's all they know how to do. All they know how to do is fund NGO's; send a lot of money and brochures and organise it at a people power level and get them all out on the streets and hope to provoke some kind of a crackdown from the authorities and then complain about it in the western media. Well you know what? Complain all you like. If you go to the BBC website all you can see is Hong Kong protests enter 6th day, 7th day, 8th day, 9th day. The same thing every single day for the past week. On their main story. It's like go away, give it up! Don't you have something else to write about? I don't care and nobody else cares and there's nothing they can do about it.

All they can do is fund some kind of phoney people power, manipulative demonstrations which has the goal of infiltrating and in some way subverting China and the Chinese authorities. And it's not going to happen because I mean, really? The fact that they are even trying to do this in China is laughable because the Chinese don't really respond well to that kind of thing. They don't care. One thing about the Chinese is that they have been closed off for centuries, it's only in recent decades that it has come back out and joined the rest of the world and even then only in the form of making all of our plastic crap etc.

It's ridiculous that they are even trying to do this because the Chinese just probably don't care. They are certainly doing something to try and stop it happening but it's not going to succeed in any way and there you go! Good job America! It's not even like the boy who cried wolf; it's not like they are crying wolf they are just trying this stupid, ridiculous regime change operations over and over again. The problem is you get away with doing that at the beginning when people don't expect it. "Hey, that was pretty smart, that was a sneaky manoeuvre there. You really caught me out on that one".But after 70 years of it? People kind of start to get to know what you're up to and the kind of things you do. Like Putin said: "Comrade Wolf knows who to eat and he does it without consulting anybody". Something along those lines. Russia and China obviously have closer and closer ties and I wouldn't be surprised if Russia is advising the Chinese - if they need it - on what to do here.

Niall: The people organising this in Hong Kong, they are the Hong Kong elites that were left behind by the Brits. They don't give a damn about human rights or universal suffrage or whatever it is that they are hanging this cause on. The same political power has been in power since 1991. That's Martin Lees united democrats party, he is one of the two heads of this protest movement. Martin Lee and the other one is a woman called Anson Chan; she is married to an oil baron, she has an honorary title of the British Empire; here is the full title, I've got to clear my throat for this: Honorary Dame Grand Cross of the order of St Michael and St George. I kid you not.

She was known in the 1990's as the Iron lady deputy to then British governor Chris Patten. She is a kind of Chinese Khodorkovsky.

Harrison: She speaks with a perfect British accent.

Niall: Oh they all do. The protesters are waving the Union Jack in the streets for Christ's sake. One of her backers in Hong Kong is the Hong Kong democratic foundation 'think tank' whose chairman is George Cautherley. He is a Brit; OBE. He is chairman of at least 7 massive European big pharma companies and that's just some of the links. They are oligarchs.

Joe: I would just round them all up. People just don't understand. This is the same argument used in Venezuela when Chavez was still alive. About the lack of freedom of the press; the lack of proper political processes in terms of allowing any party and banning political parties. The analogy is that you're in a house and it's full of sheep and there's a bunch of wolves at the door. They want to come in and you have the door locked and they are saying, "That's not fair, you've locked the door! Why don't you let us in? Freedom and Democracy! Wolves should be allowed to go have it with the sheep. We're not really wolves, we're just sheepy wolves, wolfy sheeps, we're just the same as you! Let us in! Come on what's wrong. You're so anti-democratic, what's wrong with you, you've no respect for human rights". Once they get in they are going to devour everything. And the smart person knows, no F'ing way. And if I have to be labelled anti-democratic to make sure that you don't get in here then so be it. If I was the Chinese authorities or the authorities in Hong Kong, I would just round them all up; all the supporters, all the protesters and all of their backers.

Niall: And deport them to the US.

Joe: Deport them to the US, well, it's a bit far - Taiwan. I'd put them in nice boats; Hong Kong's right on the sea; ship them over to Taiwan. There you go. You can stay in Taiwan and they're not allowed back in here. There you go. It's humanitarian, you didn't hurt anybody, you're just not allowed here. Go away! If you want to be part of the UK, go to Taiwan and get a flight to London.

Niall: Don't be deceived by the crowd sizes you are seeing here. The vast majority of people in Hong Kong are not on their sides. Compared with the rest of China, Hong Kong has an even worse disparity between the rich and the poor but that's because of the entrenched oligarchal and western interests. Nested in there that organised these damn protests. They are the problem; they are not the answer to Hong Kong's problem.

Joe: There have been big protests and Hong Kong is one of the most densely populated places on the planet. Well, maybe it's not but it has a lot of people. There is 7.5 million people just in Hong Kong which is a very small place so it is fairly densely populated so when you see 10-20,000 people out of 7.5 million...

Harrison: In July there was an unofficial referendum. Now this was done using a cell phone app and it was a question about the reform to the electoral process, because one of the things they are protesting for is universal suffrage, so the ability to basically have one person one vote to directly elect the chief executive of Hong Kong. So they had this unofficial referendum. And according to the The received votes, ballots on these apps from about one fifth of the electoral population. Of the people who actually have the right to vote. The thing is, first of all they admit that this wasn't a very accurate thing because there could have been duplicate votes. It's just a phone app so the results aren't that accurate. But if you just look at those numbers; one fifth of the voting population. Even if every one of these app voters was in support of this agenda it's still not a full referendum, it doesn't give an idea of the true demographics of what's going on there.

So we've got these protests going on, which like you said Niall, 10/20,000, who knows how many. They are not necessarily representative of the whole population. You've also got anti-occupy central protests going on at the same time. So are we really seeing a democracy at work here?

Niall: No we're not. Chan and Lee and the student leader Benny what's-his-name? The three of them, in July also actually. I wonder, it must have been coordinated. They went to the UK first to meet Nick Clegg the deputy prime minister and then they went for an 'atta-boy' with Biden at the Washington state department.

Joe: That's so ridiculous. The arrogance of these people. Of course we live in an Anglo-American empire so it's not surprising that this happens but the arrogance is still staggering. When they talk about freedom and democracy. They believe they have the authority to go anywhere in the world and decide that, "This government isn't correct, we should change this government", and they do it in a manipulative and sneaky way. The fact that they have ulterior motives and it's nothing to do with freedom and democracy, it's that they do it in a secretive and sneaky way. They don't simply take polls or allow for local people to express their wishes. Everything you see in these revolutions is all, generally speaking, manipulated. And like we were talking about earlier, it's promoted by the western media in a way that they are giving you a reality, simply because it's reported. They don't report on something, like in Ukraine, Doesn't happen; doesn't exist. If they report on something suddenly that's the consensus reality. It's a completely manufactured consensus reality; it bears no resemblance to what is actually going on on the ground. This is ultimately a war for people's minds.

Niall: The Chinese media have really nailed it. In July, this Chan and Lees visit to the US; they went to see Pelosi in the senate then they went to see state department officials. The Chinese said it was, "inviting foreign intervention and reflected their fetish for western authority". Nailed it.

Harrison: Well just a few more of the leaders that are involved in this movement, they've all got ties with US western NGO's; like the National Endowment for Democracy and the National Democratic Institute. If we look at some of these guys, there's Jimmy Lai Chee-Ying. Now he's the owner of Apple Daily news and speaking of Taiwan Joe, he was apparently chased out of Taiwan for trying to meddle in Taiwan's politics.

Joe: Internal affairs.

Harrison: He actually had a meeting in June with Paul Wolfowitz, one of the arch neocons. The neocons are all involved in these NGO's like the national democratic institute. So we are seeing neocons the people who push this policy and increasingly Obama's policy. These are the guys pushing for democracy in Hong Kong. Then you have got this 17 year old kid, Joshua Yung or something like that; you can see pictures of him online. He looks like he is 12 years old; he has received funding from the state department in the US. All these guys make regular trips to the state department and have conversations with these people. This part of it isn't even sneaky, it's totally out in the open. And all these Chinese protesters, even this young kid, they're just useful idiots. They might really think that they are fighting for a just cause, "Yeah, we want to be able to vote and to elect the leader that we want", well that's not what you're going to get. Democracy is a joke; democracy doesn't exist anywhere on this planet. They are looking for help from the United States! I mean what a bastion of democracy.

Joe: The most anti-democratic country that ever existed in modern or even ancient history, going back to Rome.

Harrison: So what did they think they could get?

Joe: Well they are not aware of any of that, they are like the average Ukrainian or the average Pole. They have still got stars in their eyes about America and freedom and democracy. They have bought the bullshit; they have drunk the cool aid.

Niall: And now they are zombies to be avoided like the plague. They're not equipped to...

Joe: They are the wrong people to be leading anything because they are mentally deficient in that sense.

Niall: Today is Election Day in Brazil. Do you see any results coming in there Joe? It might be too early.

Joe: Let me just get on the hotline here.

Niall: Rousseff was favourite, barely.

Joe: Then they might go to a run off or a second poll because there's two: Marina Silva and then the other guy who between them might get enough votes if she doesn't get an outright majority. Which will probably be the case.

Niall: A few things about Marina Silva, SOTT editor Juliana Barembuem wrote an article about this recently where she mentions these elections. Some very very dubious incidents happened in the run up. A month or two ago one of the candidates has died in a plane crash. He was the socialist party candidate and his running mate was to be Marina Silva who was leader of the green party. She then took his place as the number two candidate and this woman has got western Washington fetish written all over her. She is basically funded by George Soros, indirectly anyway, totally pro-Israel. I found an article from the 2010 elections, the last elections in Brazil, in which the history of the green party there is just riddled with CIA. Basically there's definitely some kind of manipulation going on there somewhere from the US. No surprise. They've been doing it in South America since forever.

The US has 10 consulates in the country. 10. The third highest in the world after Canada and Mexico. They are all over the place.

Joe: 10 Trojan horses. The US consulates are Trojan horses. People should remove them from their country completely. They should not ever have any kind of US embassy or consulate of any description. They should have no foothold because they are extremely suspect. They are not to be trusted. Ever.

There was this thing on Rousseff where she was polled, our favourite thing! The polls show that she is within touching distance of an outright victory.

Niall: She was in 2010 as well and there was something going on there to force a run off, but she won anyway. This is the thing about democracy, democracy in the way that it functions is dangerous in the sense that it's an opening. You are running a serious risk if you try to have elections. Certainly If you model them on US elections or European for that matter, because every four years the chances are that you are going to be subverted back in the other direction that you are trying to get away from.

For 12 years now Brazil has finally started and moved towards basically taking control of its own country. But you see if you have elections every four years it's an open invitation.

Joe: That's why you have to do it what Venezuela does. Because once you have someone in power who has mass popular appeal and is backed up by hard evidence that the leader is actually doing what he says he is going to do, that he actually cares about the ordinary people and he not only says the right things but does the right things, like Chavez did. Once you get that then you keep that person in power. People should just rally and that person should just stay in power for as long as they are compos mentis. That is the only way to secure sovereignty - real sovereignty - and the will of the people in this world. Essentially dictators. They should clamp down on media and press, foreign media especially, and any media that is aggressively anti-government and aggressively the mandate of the dictator. Mandated by the people.

Niall: The current Brazilian president Rousseff is pretty much universally maligned in the international press.

Joe: Yeah of course! Because she is a member of BRICS.

Niall: And in her own country! She can't get any favourable coverage in her own country! It's all privately owned, she has been battered left, right and centre despite that fact that, like I've said, Brazil has really improved. It's like "Oh, high inflation" and "Oh, there's still a lot of poor people"! Well yeah, that's because you started from scratch. It is better there that it was 12 years ago; it's insane. Thankfully I think Brazilians are going to keep her, we'll see. It's early days.

Joe: So generally speaking the outlook on the state of the world this week is not good. It's the same as last week. (laughs) From a climate and geological perspective the planet is continued in its upheaval and despite that, all of that is played down and ignored; except the major incidents and they are only publicised for a short period of time. And what grabs the headlines is this insane manoeuvring and warmongering and killing and murdering of psychopaths in positions of power. That is what they are doing to distract people from the really important and interesting things that are happening on this planet which is, the planet is in chaos. Niall, tell us a bit about it.

Niall: Something like 57 volcanoes are currently erupting. Is that an increase? Yes. I'm not sure about what you would typically find but we know that four new volcanoes erupted in the last week. Not least this massive eruption in Japan. The Japanese eruption, Ontake, is the second biggest volcano in Japan. Fuji is next. And Ontake was dormant until 1979 and hadn't erupted since then which is why it killed so many people who were climbing the volcano because it was not supposed to erupt and it did. Spectacularly.

Major flooding. The flooding is just unbelievable. In France there was over a foot of rain hit Montpellier. Over a foot! That's 12-something inches in 2 hours! I don't even know what that looks like. I saw what the results looked like.

Joe: When it falls that fast and it falls from the sky, it may as well have been dropped all at once because it just runs off the top of the ground. It's a foot of water suddenly streaming down your streets and if you are in a hilly area, your car's going with it and probably your house.
There has been a lot of sporadic flooding across the US in various places.

Niall: Partially sporadic, partially following a pattern. There has been a really strong hurricane season in the Pacific; Baja, California, was battered by at least one of them. Hurricane Odile, it actually made landfall. It was the strongest ever Pacific side hurricane to make landfall; category 4. It smashed a popular US tourist resort who didn't evacuate beforehand because of wasn't expected. It made a sudden turn and once it made that turn and came on land down that very tape like long peninsula it went the whole way up and stayed on land the whole way up and just destroyed everything in its path.

Four days before there was hurricane Norbert and at least two other hurricanes in the last 10 days, have just brought so much rain to the south west of the US where there is a record drought going on remember!

Joe: California is desiccated.

Niall: It's desiccated, it's inflamed but it's also, locally, totally inundated. Cars were just washed off the street.

Joe: That's just the worst possible combination because the water just runs off. Most of the entire area is on a drought warning; they don't know where they are going to get their water from. I don't know what they are going to do. I don't know where they are going to get water from. This is projecting forward, if it continues. But like you said, if they keep getting these sporadic monsoon things that just flows down hillsides and mountains and floods towns and cities.

Niall: The only ways in and out of Las Vegas were destroyed. Maybe someone in the area can correct me on this but as I understand it, Las Vegas was shut down for a while about 10 days ago. The highway was just completely washed out.

Joe: The point of all this it that these are signs of things to come.

Niall: These were partially connected with storm fronts coming out of the sea, these hurricanes. But there are others that just come out of the clear blue sky; in north eastern states for example. There is no storm front one day. You can have one county where they don't even know it's raining and in the next county over, where they have up to 10 inches of rain. Some of the stuff is really weird. Everyone says the same thing, "it's unheard of, it breaks all previous records".

Obviously the Montpellier one was massive but 10 days before that, 30 miles to the west in the south of France, there was actually even more dangerous system that killed 6 people. Whatever way it fell, it gathered somewhere higher up in the hills and then came down and was channelled through a valley and came down as one solid block, and it just wiped out a small town.

This is the kind of thing which in my mind is the kind of thing I used to hear happened in India, Thailand, Pakistan, monsoon places; in southern China. But those places too are reporting record rainfall.

Joe: But it's moving up. I think it's called the great band of precipitation or something like that around the equator that causes monsoons. That is moving north as part of an encroaching ice age and the prognosis is, that eventually the increased large amounts of rainfall in a short period of time that causes flash floodings, will at some point in the future fall as snow in the northern hemisphere. So when you get 10 inches of rain falling as snow, that's 10 feet of snow in a few hours. So get your snow shovels out. It won't help but get them out anyway. (laughs)

Niall: There was an extraordinary incident in south eastern Spain 2 weeks ago. A 20 minute long hailstorm. You are just running out of words to describe it; it flooded this town. There was a TV crew that got out there after and I didn't understand what the people were saying as they were speaking Spanish of course but the look on their faces was like, "This is impossible! I live in the south of Spain!" It's practically a desert, it's summer.

Joe: It's still summer in September, it's still 30 degrees.

Niall: "Why am I shovelling 2 feet of hail from outside of my front door?"

Joe: Because that is the cooling of the upper atmosphere and like we said, the increased amount of precipitation.

Niall: It goes way beyond that, you have got to think about what forces would normally keep those macro climate situations, like a band of monsoon type rains around the equator, what forces have changed so that that moves up? Something is clearly taken out of the equation or added to it depending on how you look at it.

Joe: Slowing of the earth's rotation; changes in global currents, under sea currents. That whole system is what has kept the planet in the condition it has been for quite a long time, when that suddenly starts to change...

Niall: But you have to go further than that.

Joe: Melting ice caps.

Niall: All of these are symptoms of something much much bigger.

Joe: I don't know what's going on out there in the cosmos but here on the planet there is a direct observable effect that is being observed. With the changes that are happening. What the ultimate cause is, is out there in space or whatever but ultimately on the planet it can be tracked as to why these climate changes are happening. And they are happening because the entire system is changing.

Niall: Sometimes I think the universe is toying with us. On September the 6th there was some fairly widespread coverage about some near flyby of an asteroid; I can't remember its number. It was giving a little shrift in the media because it was going to fly within the geosynchronous orbits of some of our further satellites. A little titillation but no fear, 'it's not going to hit'. The next day there were two major fireballs. One of which hit. We were doing the radio show and I think we just heard it. A meteorite impacted Nicaragua. Since then I think there has been an explosion. And they kind of sent a warning "Oh we are expecting a lot more NEO's" - near earth objects - "We are entering some kind of debris stream".

There have been so many fireballs this last month; it has definitely picked up. And we've got the American Media Society saying, typically the last quarter of the year is where it really picks up relative to the rest of the year.

Joe: So it's going to be a rocky end to the year folks but hopefully we will have a smooth end to the show which is happening right now. Harrison is going to take us out with some interesting tid bits.

Harrison: First of all speaking of weird lights in the sky, the last week at least has seen some weird UFOs. Did you guys see the video of the Hong Kong one? That was a weird one.

Niall: Uh huh, there were two separate incidents.

Harrison: There were two separates? Check those out, we have got them up on SOTT. There was another one I saw just last night over Breckenridge Colorado on Friday morning. There were reports of three strange lights in the sky. Now this was in broad daylight and a local news crew actually filmed it. You can search this report and see the news report. He said he talked to everyone, NORAD, the FAA, there was nothing going on in the area and he and the people he talked to don't think it was drone either. You can see this thing, it's just a light in the sky, a bright dot of light and it was seen over a valley and over a tiny mountain. He said that they had their camera stationed on it and it would be perfectly still for 5 to 6 minutes, 10 to 15 minutes, and then it would just zip to a new location, stay there for several minutes and then zip. Tonnes of people saw it, they got it on camera.

I haven't found a report for this one but in that same report they said that there was a similar sighting the day before in Salt Lake City. The coverage of it was actually pretty good - they do make the occasional joke - but usually when you see reports in the mainstream media on regular news reports they play with it or whatever but this guy and the people he was interviewing genuinely didn't know what was going on. It was just this weird light in the sky.

That's a recurring phenomenon so it will be interesting to watch how that progresses.

Joe: I reckon so; it could be a correlation between the two.

Niall: I think there has been an uptick in...

Joe: Rocky lights in the sky and weird lights. Anyway we are going to leave it there for this week folks. Thanks to our listeners and to our chatters and don't forget you can call in. Don't be a stranger. We will see you next week with another show, until then have a good one.

Niall: Bye Bye!