Two days ago, Bibi sought to explain why, in the space of a few hours, Israeli soldiers, under his orders, massacred 63 people, including 17 children, in the Shuja'iya neighborhood to the east of Gaza City. He said:
"We have to protect ourselves. We try to target the rocketeers, we do. And all civilian casualties are not intended by us but actually intended by Hamas who want to pile up as many civilian dead as they can because somebody said they use telegenically dead Palestinians for the cause. They want the more dead the better."Think about that for a moment, and while you do so, consider this image of a Palestinian girl in her father's arms. Half of her head was blown off by Netanyahu's soldiers in the Shuja'iya neighborhood two days ago.
What Netanyahu is saying is "the Palestinians are MAKING us kill them". Many parallels could be drawn with this statement. The rapist who accuses his victim of 'making him do it' or 'asking for it'; the psychologically deranged murderer who claims that he killed prostitutes 'to save them'. When it raises its ugly head in civil society, this kind of twisted psychopathic thinking provokes revulsion and is universally condemned, yet when Netanyahu employs it in relation to the Israeli attack on Gaza, it's accepted as a reasonable argument that absolves him and his shock troops of the mass murder of civilians.
In spewing such pathological musings on the value of Palestinians life, Netanyahu is merely echoing the equally psychopathic thoughts of former Israeli Prime Minister Golda Meir, who in the 1960s attempted to justify Israeli murder of Palestinian children by saying essentially the same thing:
"When peace comes, we will perhaps in time be able to forgive the Arabs for killing our sons, but it will be harder for us to forgive them for having forced us to kill their sons. Peace will come when the Arabs start to love their children more than they hate us." - Golda MeirStaged Palestinian Terror and Rocket Attacks?
Israel's latest terror attack on Gaza was supposedly provoked by the kidnapping and murder of 3 Israeli teenagers last month. The Israeli government blamed Hamas, but provided no evidence to back up their allegation. By the modern legal standards of any civilized society, the murder of the Israeli teenagers remains an unsolved crime. But Israel isn't a modern civilized society, it is an apartheid society, and more primitive standards of law and justice apply there.
The murder of the three Israeli teens was used to launch an attack on Gaza, which Hamas allegedly responded to by firing 'rockets' into Israel. This, in turn, was used by Israel to expand its bombing and murder campaign in Gaza, including a ground invasion that is still ongoing and has resulted in the massacre of over 600 Palestinian civilians and the wounding of thousands.
The Israeli military has targeted hospitals, mosques and a sports stadium, because the Palestinians 'made them do it'. There is a serious problem however with Israeli justification for the attack on Gaza.
As I already noted, there is NO evidence that Hamas was to blame. In fact, the Palestinian Authority Foreign Minister Riyad Al-Maliki suggested that Israel itself may have staged the kidnapping or that it was carried out by "Jewish criminals". I share his opinion, which is based in common sense. Israel needed a justification to attack Gaza and, as on so many occasions in the past, a justification in the form of an apparent attack on Israelis landed in their lap.
I have already pointed out how the Israeli govt. knew within 24 hrs that the teens were dead, yet they kept up the charade of searching for them for almost 3 weeks and placed a gag order on the press. One week after the kidnapping, leading Israeli journalist Noam Sheizaf effectively broke the gag order by stating in a Facebook post that the Israeli government's goal was to "preserve the local and international legitimacy" for a military policy aimed at Hamas.
Israel had a plan to attack Gaza, it needed justification, so it manufactured it, and then covered up the fact that it did so. It is therefore common sense to conclude that the most likely culprit in the kidnapping and murder of the three Israeli boys is someone acting on behalf of the state of Israel itself, because they had both the strongest motive and the best opportunity and have been caught manipulating information in order to justify the Gaza murder spree.
Manipulating information is what Israel does. It's what Israel HAS to do to justify to the world its existence on, and continued theft of, Palestinian land.
Imagine that someone in your neighborhood falsely claimed ownership of another neighbor's house, forcibly took physical possession of it, kicked the original residents out into a tent in the street and proceeded to imprison the original residents in said tent. How do you imagine such a person would be able to maintain and justify their illegal occupation if not by the use of force against any attempts to take back what was stolen and the use of regular lies and manipulation of anyone else who dared to try and point out the obvious injustice of the situation? If such a situation persisted long enough, you can imagine that the illegal occupier would be forced to develop all sorts of underhanded strategies and ploys to maintain his 'right' to someone else's property. One example of a useful strategy in this context would be to create the illusion that you are being attacked in order to level the 'moral' playing field between you and your victim.
Back in 2008, just after Israel launched 'Operation Cast Lead' that resulted in the mass murder of almost 1,500 Palestinian civilians, Robert Siegel, host of NPR's 'All Things Considered' interviewed Ahmed Yusuf, the political adviser to Hamas leader Ismail Haniyeh.
Yusuf complained to Siegel that there was no point in engaging in a ceasefire with Israel because Israel usually reneged on the promises it makes to open border crossings into Gaza:
Mr. YUSUF: You know, actually, we have said we are willing to extend the cease-fire. But the terms that we have agreed upon in Cairo, the Israelis never fulfilled their promises. They're supposed to have these crossings open for humanitarian aid. Unfortunately, 50 percent of the time, these crossing never opened, and the number of the trucks that's supposed to come daily to Gaza - there is no cement, no asphalt, no plastic, or everything. Many items of medical supplies not allowed to cross to Gaza.This was not the first time that a Palestinian politician claimed that alleged attacks on Israelis were in fact the work of Israeli agents. On many occasions, the Palestinian leadership has pointed the finger at Israel as the real 'rocketeer'. Once in a while, the Israeli military at least admits that rockets were not fired by Hamas. At other times, it admits that it deliberately lied about Palestinian rocket attacks to justify 'reprisal' missile strikes. The first recorded claim of Israeli manufacturing of Palestinian terrorism came from the venerable Yasser Arafat in 1995 when he claimed that a suicide bombing attributed to Palestinians was the work of Israelis.
SIEGEL: But, wasn't the response of firing rockets into Israel... wasn't that guaranteed to bring on this retaliation by the Israelis?
Mr. YUSUF: No. No. This has nothing to do with firing rockets because there is no rockets fired. There are collaborators, sometimes they fire based on the Israeli asking them maybe to fire some of these home-made projectiles. They know that Hamas did their best to protect the border and not to let anybody firing rockets.
SIEGEL: But you're saying that when rockets have been fired out of Gaza, you're saying that those are being fired by Israeli collaborators whom the Israelis are arranging for them to do that...
Mr. YUSUF: Actually, we all - let me try me to check if there is anybody actually - we check with those political and militant group who are really showing their commitment. And when we check, well, they - all them denied any of them been firing rockets. So, who been firing these rockets? We don't have an explanation except from those Israeli collaborators.
"Soon after the Beit Lid massacre, in which 21 Israeli soldiers were killed by two Islamic Jihad suicide bombers, Palestinian Authority chief Yasser Arafat told a group of visiting dignitaries that right-wing Israelis had collaborated with the killers. Otherwise, he said, the killers could not have passed through several army check posts without being stopped."In a 2001 interview with several leading Italian publications, Palestinian Authority President Yasser Arafat went into some detail regarding the genesis and operation of Hamas. To Corriere della Sera on Dec. 11, he said:
"We are doing everything possible to stop the violence. But Hamas is a creature of Israel which, at the time of Prime Minister [Yitzhak] Shamir [the late 1980s, when Hamas arose], gave them money and more than 700 institutions, among them schools, universities and mosques. Even [former Israeli Prime Minister Yitzhak] Rabin ended up admitting it, when I charged him with it, in the presence of [Egyptian President Hosni] Mubarak."In an interview with L'Espresso on Dec. 19, Arafat said:
"Hamas was constituted with the support of Israel. The aim was to create an organization antagonistic to the PLO [Palestine Liberation Organization]. They [Hamas] received financing and training from Israel. They have continued to benefit from permits and authorizations, while we have been limited, even [for permits] to build a tomato factory. Rabin himself defined it as a fatal error. Some collaborationists of Israel are involved in these [terrorist] attacks. We have the proof, and we are placing it at the disposal of the Italian government."Recently, an Israeli Defense Prize winner and aerospace engineering expert Dr. Moti Shefer, called into question the reality of Israel's lauded 'Iron Dome' missile defense system that supposedly "shoots down Hamas rockets":
"There is no missile in the world today able to intercept missiles or rockets. Iron Dome is a sound and light show that is intercepting only Israeli public opinion, and itself, of course. Actually, all the explosions you see in the sky are self explosions. No Iron Dome missile has ever collided with a single rocket. [...] The rockets announced as intercepted by Iron Dome either never reach the ground, or are virtual rockets invented and destroyed on the Iron Dom control computer. To this day, no one has ever seen an intercepted rocket fall to the ground."The Problem With Israel
"What lands here is what's launched. The parts we see on the ground are from Iron Dome itself. We're shooting at ourselves, mainly virtually.
According to Dr. Shefer, Iron Dome is a part of a broad conspiracy, in which two interested parties afraid of peace are participating: the defense industries and Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu."
The problem with Israel isn't merely that it is an Apartheid state where Palestinians (both in Israel and in the occupied territories) are treated as second class citizens, at best; there have been (and are) many nations around the world that brutally treat a section of their populations. The real problem with Israel is the image it presents of itself as a little slice of the 'West' in the Middle East surrounded by hoards of atavistic Arabs baying for Jewish blood and against whom Israel is fighting, on behalf of the people of Western nations, in the supposed 'clash of civilizations'.
The problem is not only that this image is entirely false, but in manipulating Western citizens into accepting this false image as true, the state of Israel makes Western citizens accomplices in the slaughter of innocent civilians, children included. This is the real problem of Israel for the people of the world and in particular the people of Western nations who are very much the primary target of this attempt to, essentially, subvert their souls, or at least their humanity (or what is left of it).
Israel's ongoing attack on the people of Gaza represents a choice (albeit a weighted one) for the people of this planet. A gun is being held (figuratively and literally) to the head of a small child, and the question being put to the 'civilized' West is:
'Is there ANY situation under which it is appropriate to pull the trigger?'
Too many people are allowing themselves to be manipulated by the despicable lies and manipulations of psychopaths in positions of power to answer 'yes'. In doing so, they are pushing us all, as a global society, closer to the brink (and perhaps over the edge) of complete moral bankruptcy. The history of human civilizations is littered with, not only the stories, but the actual ruins of civilizations that provoked devastating catastrophes because they lost their connection to their own humanity.
I started this essay with a truly psychopathic statement from Netanyahu that amounted to accusing the 600 slaughtered Palestinians of making Israel slaughter them ('look what you made me do!') I'll finish with a slightly less egregious, but equally schizophrenic, statement made by US Sec. of State John Kerry who, in referring to the situation in Gaza, appeared to be experiencing the obvious problem of trying to project a humanitarian face to the world while ensuring that that same face remained firmly planted between the butt cheeks of the murderous Israeli regime.
"I'm deeply concerned about the consequences of Israel's appropriate and legitimate effort to defend itself."
Reader Comments
Its like something is pushing the 'rage' button on the species.
...just my current wishful thinking...
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[Carats >> ... >especially concerning their attitude towards violence.>He compared true and approximated sunspot records and found that the greatest social events, like military conflicts and revolts involving large numbers of people, took place around or close to a sunspot maximum. As a result of this research, Alexander Chizhevsky was jailed for about five years by the Soviet regime.<<
[...]
However, accepting the theory of Chizhevsky and considering it a basis, we could readily conclude that we are now on the verge of a global war using weapons of mass destruction. I say this because according to my analysis the expected intensity of the upcoming solar maximum will be in the next three years (2013 to 2016) and it will be the highest recorded solar maximum, ’provided’ the Sun will indeed be at its highest position in the galaxy when it will reverse its magnetic field."
Now, clearly this solar maximum is not turning out to be particularly intense, in fact is is one of the weakest on record so far. However, the concept might be a piece of the puzzle. Maybe world leaders (or shadow leaders) take advantage of this phenomenon?
Here are some more links providing information about the topic:
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"Edward R. Dewey, founder of the Foundation for the Study of Cycles, analyzed and published his data in 1951 in the Foundation's publications.[7] In a 1971 book Dewey described the "four components" of Chizhevsky's eleven-year cycle and their approximate lengths: 1) a three-year period of minimum activity characterized by passivity and autocratic rule; 2) a two-year period during which masses begin to organize under new leaders and one theme; 3) a three-year period of maximum excitability, revolution and war; 4) a three-year period of gradual decrease in excitability until the masses are apathetic. Dewey questioned Chizhevsky's theory because in Chizhevsey's data, the sunspot cycle height lagged about a year ahead his "mass excitability index."[8]"
Just my thoughts.
Where are the comets?
"Cellphone Video Documents Israeli Sniper Executing Wounded Civilian In Gaza … As Well As The Overwhelming Devastation Of Gaza"
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Only by viewing would one understand the absolute carnage and terror!
@Mandatory Intellectomy:
It will get worse.
The vast bulk, the near totality, of human activity/energy, meaning and including all activity that might ordinarily be considered 'normal' and/or 'good', aka, instinctive, natural and rational (like the raising of children and the growing of food), is being utilized and doctored in ways that protect and keep the worst psychopaths firmly in control, and safely away from all forms of prosecution/justice and termination.
This is the result of centuries of selective, technological implementation and, through this, the transformation of society, the so-called globalization/centralization process.
People, most people, unfortunately, have been (and are) incredibly stupid and gullible and easy to catch. Equally unfortunately, you can't really blame them, they are what they are.
You ply them with techno-treats and you tell them amazing futurology stories or more 'wonders-to-come'.
And the ones you can't catch and mind control in this manner (those that actually see through the madness and resist), you simply kill.
So, now with more people figuring these things out, the pressing need (of the psychos) is to kill more.
SO:
Having figured this out, do you feel like fighting (back, resisting)?
Losing?
And dying miserably?
So do I.
ned
What I find, is those under mind control prefer to ostracize truth-tellers rather than face their own cognitive dissonance. In that way, truth-tellers don't have to be literally killed. They can be made "dead" to the brain-dead.
Here in North Cyprus and Turkey and most probably many other places all flags have been at half mast for days now in allegiance with the awful genocide of all the innocent Palestinians at the hands - and murders by the Israeli murderers and all those psychopathic countries that support all these inhuman acts of barbaric bloodbaths.
Time that the same and worse happens to all the perpetrators - Zionists and their minions who slaughter Gaza and plant bombs on Malaysian flight of yet more innocent people.
The squeeze is 'on'. The darkest hour is just before dawn. Keep focused people.
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Take care
Kent
X Factor mogul sent images of dead children on Twitter after he donated money to soldiers' organisation....[Link]
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To help the situation, Hamas could stop hiding weapons in mosques, schools, and civilian neighborhoods. They could stop firing rockets from these locations as well. If they want to fight Israel, they need to move their operations out into the open and stop hiding behind civilians. They also need to stop digging tunnels into Israel.
The stupidity of this article is amazing.
Israel completely pulled out of Gaza in 2005. They removed their civilians out of their home. Instead of building a new and better life, the Gazans elected Hamas. Instead of building a new, prosperous nation, Hamas has done nothing but squander resources to continue the fight with Israel.
Do you know ANYTHING about international conflicts? The solution to them is not merely to "stop fighting" it is to ensure that the fighting CAN stop by addressing the problems that gave rise to the fighting in the first place. Keep those conditions in place, and you ensure that the conflict continues.
Israel STOLE AND STEALS PALESTINIAN LAND AND IMPRISONS PALESTINIANS! Is that FACT so very hard for you to get into your skull? THAT is the source of the conflict. DUH!
Yes, I know a lot about international conflicts, and I have studied middle eastern history for years.
Israel didn't steal Palestinian land. There has never been a state of Palestine. Let's take a little walk down through history. The Canaanites lived there, they were conquered by Israel, Israel was conquered by the Assyrians and Babylonians, who were then conquered by the Greeks, who were driven out by the Israelis, who were then conquered by the Romans. The Romans scattered the Israelis out of the land. The Romans (Byzantines) were conquered by the Muslims and the area was ruled by the Ottomans for centuries. In WWI the land was conquered by the Allies because the Ottomans fought on the side of the Germans. After WWII the British decided to leave and split the land between the Jews and Arabs who both lived there. The Israelis have had a presence in the land for millenia. The Arabs have too.
The United Nations voted to divide the land and Israel became a nation on a tiny sliver in 1948. What happened? They were attacked on all sides. They expanded. What happened later? Israel was attacked again on all sides. They expanded.
Gaza belonged to the Egyptians and the West Bank belonged to the Jordanians. There never was a state of Palestine.
The Israelis have offered the Palestinians their own state on multiple occasions. They offered Arafat 95% of everything the Palestinians wanted. What happened? They turned it down.
The violence against Israel will never be the answer to the Palestinian hope for their own independent state. I support the right of the Palestinian people to their own state. They need to stop the violence against Israel once and for all. Then they can live in peace.
I grieve for the civilian causalities in this conflict on both sides. I grieve for the children who are suffering because of the wrong choice Hamas continues to make along with all those Gazans who are pro-violence as a solution.
I think Egypt should give the Sinai to the Palestinians for their state. They would have a huge area with a lot of resources including oil revenue and part of the Suez canal revenues. Those Palestinians who live in the West Bank should be given a choice. Migrate to Palestine situated in the Sinai and Gaza, Migrate to Jordan (who controlled the West Bank before Israel, or be granted citizenship in Israel as long as they forsake violence.
@Aeneas
I'm not blaming the victims for their own deaths. I place the blame on Hamas for their violence against Israel. Hamas started this conflict.
Now all their children share genetic markers from all of them.
No, that is not what I'm saying. When the British left and the UN divided the land there were Jews and Arabs both living there side-by-side. The Jews were already living in the land. They didn't just suddenly arrive when that happened.
Given, there were a lot of Jews who migrated to the new state of Israel. After all, they are hated and persecuted for being Jews in every country on Earth. I can't blame them for wanting to go live somewhere they might be a little safer from things like the Holocaust.
If, on the other hand, he's a hasbara agent, it's time to file your progress report and collect your study grant or other monies. But if you want to be honest in your progress report to your bosses, you can make it short and sweet: EPIC FAIL.
It is easy to say someone is ignorant, but everything I have said from a history point-of-view is backed up by solid academic scholarship. You can go look it up yourself to verify it.
It is a fact Hamas started shooting rockets first as they have done over-and-over. They do not discriminate between military targets and civilian populations.
It is a fact Israel pulled completely out of Gaza in 2005. They have been independent and self governing. I understand why Israel manages all incoming imports to try to keep the weapons out (though obviously not as successful as they would hope).
It is a fact the Palestinians were offered and rejected an independent state with 95% of what they wanted.
Israel has made its mistakes. The Palestinians have made their mistakes. That is no excuse to continue violence.
By the way, how does it feel to not be burdened by empathy for other living beings? I bet it makes you feel superior doesn't it? After all, it is hard for people with empathy to live in a world run by psychopaths. People who have empathy are always going to be manipulated, walked on, used, oppressed, and murdered by those who lack consideration for others. Heck, I even have empathy for you, along with a big dose of pity that you will never know how it feels to care about other people.
Oh boy! You really need to get some serius repetition on Israel history.
In regards to its remote past I would recommend:
History and Ideology in Ancient Israel - Giovanni Garbini
David and Solomon - Israel Finkelstein and Neil Asher Silberman
Then you could read "The Invention of the Jewish People" by Shlomo Sand.
In the meantime, watch this:
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You wrote, "...there was no officially named state in that area, the powers that be decided to create the state of Israel regardless of the people already occupying that land."
Jews were living in that land just like Arabs. How could they "steal" the land they already lived on?
You wrote, "By the way, how does it feel to not be burdened by empathy for other living beings? I bet it makes you feel superior doesn't it?"
If you read all of my comments, you would see that I obviously have compassion and empathy for the Palestinians AND the Jews. I would like for the Palestinians to have their own, independent state living in peace and prosperity just like I want the Jews to have their own, independent state living in peace and prosperity.
What it looks like to me from those who have commented on my initial post is that they want the Palestinians to take all of the land even though there have been Jews living there for thousands of years. And from all the hate rhetoric that comes from Israel's enemies I can only conclude they want another Holocaust.
You are all forgetting one thing. God gave Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob the land of Israel. The boundaries stretch from the Nile all the way to the Euphrates river. This is what God thinks about all this:
"I will gather all nations and bring them down to the Valley of Jehoshaphat. There I will put them on trial for what they did to my inheritance, my people Israel, because they scattered my people among the nations and divided up my land" (Joel 3:2).
And at that time every knee will bow and every tongue will confess that a Yeshua, a Jewish man is Lord (Philippians 2:5-11). And He will rule the entire Earth with a rod of iron (Revelation 19:15).
Your are so full of bullshit, and oh what the hell bear shit too, that I don't want to waste time responding to you, even if all your bullshit and bear shit is monstrously "historical" and "academic." It's still just bullshit with sugarcoating.
Well, if Gaza is a concentration camp you can blame Egypt as much as Israel. But really, the biggest group to blame is Hamas who are violent, hate filled terrorists who only continue to hurt the Palestinian people by their choices and actions.
When Israel completely withdrew from Gaza in 2005, they could have really turned it into a beautiful, and prosperous area.
"The Canaanites lived there, they were conquered by Israel, Israel was conquered by the Assyrians and Babylonians, who were then conquered by the Greeks, who were driven out by the Israelis, who were then conquered by the Romans. The Romans scattered the Israelis out of the land."
Actually, not quite. The fake "history" of Israel was created very, very late. The conquering of Canaan by the Israelites probably never happened. Read Gmirkin's "Berossus and Genesis, Manetho and Exodus: Hellenistic Histories and the Date of the Pentateuch".
In the 11th century, Isaac ibn Yashush, a Jewish court physician in Muslim Spain, mentioned the distressing fact that a list of Edomite kings that appears in Genesis 36 named a few kings who lived long after Moses was already dead. Ibn Yashush suggested the obvious, that someone who lived long after Moses wrote the list.
Abraham ibn Ezra, a 12th century rabbi in Spain also wrote about problems in the text of the Torah. He pointed out several passages that used terms Moses would not have known, described places that Moses had never been, and used language that belonged to an altogether different time and place than the milieu of Moses - like much later. He wrote, very mysteriously,
“And if you understand, then you will recognize the truth. And he who understands will keep silent.”
Rashi de Troyes, (1040-1105), makes the astonishingly frank statement that the Genesis narrative, going back to the creation of the world, was written to justify what we might now call genocide. The God of Israel, who gave his people the Promised Land, had to be unequivocally supreme so that neither the dispossessed Canaanites nor anyone else could ever appeal against his decrees. Rashi’s precise words were that God told us the creation story and included it in the Torah,
“to tell his people that they can answer those who claim that the Jews stole the land from its original inhabitants. The reply should be; God made it and gave it to them but then took it and gave it to us. As he made it and it’s his, he can give it to whoever he chooses.”
The fact is, the Jews are still saying this, with the support of many Christian Fundamentalists for their own imperialist and economic motives.
In The Curse of Cain, Regina Schwartz writes about the relationship between Monotheism and Violence, positing that Monotheism itself is the root of violence:
"Collective Identity, which is a result of a covenant of Monotheism, is explicitly narrated in the Bible as an invention, a radical break with Nature. A transcendent deity breaks into history with the demand that the people he constitutes obey the law he institutes, and first and foremost among those laws is, of course, that they pledge allegiance to him, and him alone, and that this is what makes them a unified people as opposed to the ‘other,’ as in all other people which leads to violence. In the Old Testament, vast numbers of ‘other’ people are obliterated, while in the New Testament, vast numbers are colonized and converted for the sake of such covenants."
Schwartz also writes about the idea of the “provisional” nature of a covenant: that it is conditional.
“Believe in me and obey me or else I will destroy you.”
Doesn’t sound like there is any choice, does there? And we find ourselves in the face of a pure and simple Nazi Theophany.
It is so bad that the chief of the UN expressed his condolences to Netenyahu for the military losses!!!!!!!
And in the days after the plane crash, the nazi Kiev junta has gone all out to kill as many people as possible, whose only crime is that they will not accept the junta as their representatives.
Okay, let's take your points one by one.
MB Wrote:
The Canaanites lived there, they were conquered by Israel, Israel was conquered by the Assyrians and Babylonians, who were then conquered by the Greeks, who were driven out by the Israelis, who were then conquered by the Romans. The Romans scattered the Israelis out of the land. The Romans (Byzantines) were conquered by the Muslims and the area was ruled by the Ottomans for centuries. In WWI the land was conquered by the Allies because the Ottomans fought on the side of the Germans. After WWII the British decided to leave and split the land between the Jews and Arabs who both lived there. The Israelis have had a presence in the land for millenia. The Arabs have too.
Wow! What a load of revisionist made up history! You should write a school book! There is NO HISTORICAL EVIDENCE for a cohesive 'Jewish people' in history. In case you didn't know, religious books are not admissible as evidence.
In the 19th century intellectuals of Jewish origin in Germany who were influenced by the folk character of German nationalism, took upon themselves the task of inventing retrospectively a "Jewish people". Read Shlomo Sand's work and that of others if you are interested in the truth, which I seriously doubt.
MB Wrote:
"The United Nations voted to divide the land and Israel became a nation on a tiny sliver in 1948. What happened? They were attacked on all sides. They expanded. What happened later? Israel was attacked again on all sides. They expanded."
What a load of BS! The area where the Palestinians lived was 'promised' to the Zionist movement in 1917 by Lord Balfour. After that, successive ways of Jews emigrated because there was only a TINY community in the area before then. From 1920 onwards Jewish immigration to the area was fiercely opposed by local Arabs (Palestinians). Jewish terrorist organisations like Haganah were formed to TAKE THE LAND BY FORCE. Again, local Arabs who had been living there for centuries resisted fiercely with revolts in 1929 and 1937. Even after significant immigration the Jewish population in 1922 was at most 11%, 9% were Christian and 80% were native ARABS! Jews ethnically cleansed 700,000 Arabs from the area in 1947-48, and murdered thousands more.
MB Wrote:
Gaza belonged to the Egyptians and the West Bank belonged to the Jordanians. There never was a state of Palestine.
Jordan and Egypt only gained Palestinian land after the 1948 Arab–Israeli War, and Jordan had only been a country for two years! Egypt, while nominally independent in 1922, was under British military occupation and control until 1954. There never was ANY STATE in that area before WWII, it was part of the Ottaman Empire, so your argument is nonsensical.
MB Wrote:
The Israelis have offered the Palestinians their own state on multiple occasions. They offered Arafat 95% of everything the Palestinians wanted. What happened? They turned it down.
Horseshit. The Oslo accords for example, here's what baby-killer Netanyahu said about the "agreement" and his intention to keep it:
"They asked me before the election if I'd honor [the Oslo accords]... I said I would, but [that] I'm going to interpret the accords in such a way that would allow me to put an end to this galloping forward to the '67 borders. How did we do it? Nobody said what defined military zones were. Defined military zones are security zones; as far as I'm concerned, the entire Jordan Valley is a defined military zone. Go argue." Netanyahu then explained how he conditioned his signing of the 1997 Hebron agreement on American consent that there be no withdrawals from "specified military locations", and insisted he be allowed to specify which areas constituted a "military location"—such as the whole of the Jordan Valley. "Why is that important? Because from that moment on I stopped the Oslo Accords"
You're A LIAR Monster Bear.
MB Wrote:
The violence against Israel will never be the answer to the Palestinian hope for their own independent state. I support the right of the Palestinian people to their own state. They need to stop the violence against Israel once and for all. Then they can live in peace.
HORSESHIT. Israel STOLE AND CONTINUES TO STEAL PALESTINIAN LAND and IMPRISON ITS POPULATION. Israel has been perpetrating violence against Palestinians for DECADES. THEY NEED TO STOP, THEY NEED TO GET OFF PALESTINIAN LAND.
You're A LIAR Monster Bear.
MB Wrote:
I grieve for the civilian causalities in this conflict on both sides. I grieve for the children who are suffering because of the wrong choice Hamas continues to make along with all those Gazans who are pro-violence as a solution.
You're a sick and twisted individual. Israel is an illegal and criminal Apartheid state and, as such, needs to disappear from the pages of history. It has NO PLACE in a civilized world. It is pursuing a path that will make it, and people like you, pariahs. And it will be of your own doing because you sanction and support the murder of innocent civilians and children. You're a monster alright.
MB Wrote:
I think Egypt should give the Sinai to the Palestinians for their state. They would have a huge area with a lot of resources including oil revenue and part of the Suez canal revenues. Those Palestinians who live in the West Bank should be given a choice. Migrate to Palestine situated in the Sinai and Gaza, Migrate to Jordan (who controlled the West Bank before Israel, or be granted citizenship in Israel as long as they forsake violence.
Israel should GIVE BACK THE LAND THAT IT STOLE AND STOP STEALING LAND BELONGING TO OTHER PEOPLE AND STOP MASSACRING CIVILIANS AND CHILDREN. That is the simple and just solution to Israeli criminality and crimes against humanity. Afterwards, lot of Israeli politicians and military personnel can show up at the Hague.
Thanks for making your real feelings known. You can call me a liar all you want, but the historical record is there for anyone to study for themselves. You admit yourself that there were Jews living in the land prior the the United Nations partition, so the Jews couldn't have stolen anything. And as the UN partitioned the land by majority vote, the State of Israel is a legal world recognized entity.
The reason the Palestinians are in the current situation is the Arab violence that began in 1948 when every nation surrounding Israel attacked them without provocation. They only have their own hated and violence to blame.
Don't think you've won this debate at all because you haven't. Nor will you ever.
You haven't come out and said it, but you haven't condemned Palestinian violence. By your silence on the issue, it makes you appear to support Palestinian violence for some reason, you appear to sanction and support the murder of innocent civilians and children inside Israel. If anyone is a monster, it is those who support Palestinian violence as well.
The historical record stands on its own with a mountain of hard evidence as its foundation. Calling it revisionist is just an excuse to support your flawed position.
Joe wrote, "...There is NO HISTORICAL EVIDENCE for a cohesive 'Jewish people' in history."
What a ridiculous, completely empty assertion. All you have to do is go look it up for yourself to see you are in complete error.
Joe wrote: "In the 19th century intellectuals of Jewish origin in Germany who were influenced by the folk character of German nationalism, took upon themselves the task of inventing retrospectively a "Jewish people".
What a piece of propaganda. You must like reading fake scholars. After all, they do support your position. You accuse the majority of historians and scholars in the world of being in error. That is quite humorous.
Joe wrote, "There never was ANY STATE in that area before WWII, it was part of the Ottaman Empire, so your argument is nonsensical."
If you would have read my comments closely, you would have realized that was my point. There was never any state in that area before WWII. There was no Palestine. It was land controlled by the British and French after WWI. Get your facts straight.
As to the Olso accords, Netanyahu was not involved when the 95% offer was made by Ehud Barack to Arafat with Bill Clinton in 2000. Again, your facts are wrong.
Joe wrote, "Israel STOLE AND CONTINUES TO STEAL PALESTINIAN LAND and IMPRISON ITS POPULATION."
As I've demonstrated Israel hasn't stolen any Palestinian land. They lived there too at the time of the UN partition as you pointed out for me. Israel only expanded because of the Arab violence and wars against them in 1948 and onward. And the violence continues today. I don't expect them to give any land back when the Arab armies tried to exterminate them. The loss of any land can directly be blamed on violence and aggression.
Joe wrote, "Israel should GIVE BACK THE LAND THAT IT STOLE AND STOP STEALING LAND BELONGING TO OTHER PEOPLE AND STOP MASSACRING CIVILIANS AND CHILDREN."
The enemies and haters of Israel should stop their violence and aggression against a legal state with roots in their land that goes back thousands of years. They should stop trying to massacre Israeli civilians and children. They should stop aligning themselves with people like Adolf Hitler back during WWII.
Thank you so much for standing up for truth.
The official history, which you were taught, can be very different from the real one.
I have studied tons of sources from all perspectives on this issue.
What I find over-and-over again are "historians" who are biased one way or another. Just because it is in a book doesn't mean it is true. Just because it is written or said by a "scholar" doesn't mean it is true.
I don't trust anyone, nor any human source completely. Everyone has flaws, failures, and bias.
"I have studied tons of sources from all perspectives on this issue."
Judging by what you write here and now, the above statement is false.
I'll say it again, There is NO HISTORICAL EVIDENCE for a cohesive 'Jewish people' in history. You claim there is. Prove it.
I'll say it again. In the 19th century intellectuals of Jewish origin in Germany who were influenced by the folk character of German nationalism, took upon themselves the task of inventing retrospectively a "Jewish people". That is THE OFFICIALLY RECORDED AND ACCEPTED HISTORY OF MODERN ZIONISM. Modern Zionism created the modern state of Israel on STOLEN land, i.e. land on which almost 1 million people WERE LIVING and HAD BEEN LIVING for centuries.
Your argument is, apparently, that "god gave the land of Palestine to the Jews". So your argument is based on the made up narratives from a religious book. Good luck with that one.
Since you agree that there was no states in the area before WWII, and this, in your twisted opinion, gave Israel the right to steal the land on which Palestinians were living and HAD BEEN LIVING FOR CENTURIES, then you must also believe that the Jordanians are "not a people" and therefore have no right to their state, likewise the Egyptians, the Lebanese, the Syrians. You see the fallacy and fundamentally unjust and illegal nature of the position you are putting forth?
Ah yes, the "generous 95% offer" myth. You mean the one that offered the Palestinians scattered areas throughout the West Bank that would be choked and surrounded by Israeli Settlements, Planned Settlements and Israeli army control? The "generous offer" that that would have made it impossible for the Palestinians to travel or trade freely within their own state without the permission of the Israeli government? The one where Palestinians living in their new "independent state" would be forced to cross Israeli territory every time they traveled or shipped goods from one section of the West Bank to another? The one where Israel could close those routes at will and would also retain a network of so-called "bypass roads" that would crisscross the Palestinian state while remaining sovereign Israeli territory, further dividing the West Bank? Ah yes! Those ungrateful Palestinians not accepting a joke of a 'state' on only part of their RIGHTFULLY OWNED land and it offered to them by Israel who HAS NOT RIGHT UNDER ANY MODERN CIVILIZED LEGAL SYSTEM TO ANY LAND IN THE MIDDLE EAST save what their psychopathic "god" gave to them in his fantasy fairy story book.
Yes, you're a barefaced liar and apologist for crimes against humanity Monster Bear, and btw, that's not what I "feel", that a simple fact based on what you yourself have stated.
You wrote, "Judging by what you write here and now, the above statement is false."
A poor observation in my opinion.
You wrote, "Yes, I am 100% correct, and you continue to lie."
That is your opinion. It is my opinion you are wrong.
"I have studied tons of sources from all perspectives on this issue."
You just keep on proving here you DID NOT
mr religiously indoctrinated monster (hasbara bear)
Some selective memory there Mountain. After the demilitarized zones were established, Israelis gradually took over portions of the zone, evicting Arab villagers and demolishing their homes. Moshe Dayan, the Israeli defense minister at the time of the Six Day War, recounted in 1976 that Israeli policy in the demilitarized zones between 1949 and 1967 was "to seize some territory and hold it until the enemy despairs and gives it to us", thus changing the lines of the ceasefire accord with military actions that were less than a war. And when that failed to achieve the results they truly wanted, they turned to psychopathic military actions, and they've been stealing everything since.
Your points are completely unrelated to my quote.
As I've said, the Jews lived in the land. The UN partitioned the land. Israeli expansion didn't happen until after they were attacked by every nation surrounding them in 1948. The same in every Arab provoked war since then.
And, as I've said as well... Israel has made its mistakes. There have been individuals who have done the wrong thing on both sides. I am not saying Israel is perfect or without blame in some cases. As to your information, I'll have to take a look at it to verify it.
A direct quote from Israeli's former Defense Minister clearly states otherwise. "to seize some territory and hold it until the enemy despairs and gives it to us"
Plus, the Romans stole the land from the Israelis, so Israel taking back what was stolen from them isn't theft.
One thing that amazes me is that Islam teaches that the Jewish prophets were true prophets. From an Islamic perspective, they revealed the will of Allah to the world. God promised the land from the Nile River all the way to the Euphrates River to the Israelis. Yet, they want to destroy Israel and its people. They are fighting against God Himself, and Joel 3:2 reveals that God will judge all nations for what they have done to the Jews and dividing their land up among themselves.
Well that area is just barren, dried, fertile territory which only idiots could regard promised. Only that grows there are awful concrete Lego-like constructions searing 24/7on desert sun. Only idiots would like to move there and live forever in state of war - surrounded by pristine enemies. Bible is also the idiots' best reading which necessarily lead them to that place for chosen. - as citizen or crusader...
Mark Twain said that Israel was mostly empty and desolate when he visited there in the 1800s. Makes me wonder when all the huge masses of Arabs supposedly moved over.
If the Bible isn't true then we'd all be idiots to believe it, but I believe it is true based on huge amounts of evidence from numerous fields of scholarship.
You mention the crusades... The crusades were a political response to centuries of Muslim violence and aggression.
Monster Bear is using this handy little manual... [Link]
All over Europe, in fact. It was a reaction to the industrial revolution. So, in Germany you get The Brothers Grimm, Neuschwannstein and Richard Wagner, and In Britain, The Victorians produce sexed up, pomped up cocktail-hour versions of folk "Englishness", folk "Scottishness", folk "Welshness", in some bizarre attempt at a "return to the source". A lot of it involved Arthurian romantics out of their heads on laudanum and the like.
It wasn't all bad. Some of the music that came out of it was pretty good….[Link]
Yorkshiremen think they're god's chosen people, but they don't go around murdering children, or re-enacting the wars of the roses over it.
You are such a loser.
You think, like all psychopaths, that the lies you are propogating, will magically become the truth.
Well, maybe if you were posting your bullshit on an msm site, you might get away with it.
But when you post your crap on Sott, where knowledgeable people know their history, have a conscience, are fully aware of pathological trolls such as yourself, and can spot you a mile away, you might just as well pack your bags, because you stick out like an oil slick on a pristine mountain lake.
So why not just collect your blood money from your Israeli employers and crawl back into whatever sewer you came from.
Asshole.
Unfortunately, I'm not sure what you mean by an msm site.
I'm a knowledgeable person who knows their history. I have a conscience, and I am fully aware of internet interaction.
Just because I don't swallow Joe's presentation on the Palestinian/Israeli conflict as fact doesn't mean I'm what you imply. His article is one of the most biased, one sided pieces I've read. That is one reason why I decided after a few years to create an account and make some comments.
I don't earn money from any Israeli employers, nor do I live in a sewer.
I'm just a normal person living here on this planet with the rest of you.
Yet you just signed up on the 23rd of July?
So, umm- you didn't have a problem with what SOTT wrote about the Israeli psychopathic actions before, and just decided to sign up now?
Hasbara!
Great article and responses to Monster Bear's lies.
"No, it's a matter of fact. Facts are apparently not your strong point since you base your argument on fairy stories in a religious text."
Facts Joe? What a joke. I don't think you can actually comprehend my arguments. It might be the hatred you have in your heart toward Israel or it may be for some other unknown reason.
is enough to burn down an entire forest.
Whoever engages in violence, big or small, is a deciple of death.
It blows me away how so much hatred and agression can circulate amongst sott commentators and especially from sott's writers. I mean its crazy just to read you joe and aneas and nancyyvonne and seekintruth.
I mean seriously... if you can't even do it yourself, your efforts pointing fingers at others are worthless.
BigBear, thanks for showing some the fine art of proper (respectful) communication; regardless of the topic at hand.
You're welcome diamond eyes. I agree with your comments.
Says a lot about you....
Hope my communication was "respectful" enough for you, but probably not because it gets to the crux of the matter in an accurate and clear way (for those who have eyes to see and ears to hear).
'The' cherry-on-the-sundee redrock12? Wowa!
Israeli rabbi: It’s okay to kill innocent civilians and destroy Gaza [Link]
"The Torah of Israel guides us in all walks of life, private and public, on how to behave during war and also how to keep moral standards.’
.... Therefore, during war the attacked people are allowed to punish the enemy population in any punishment it finds worthy, such as denying supplies or electricity and also to bomb the whole area according to the discretion of the army minister and not to just simply endanger soldier’s lives but to take crushing deterrence steps to exterminate the enemy." [...]
Ministers and general to honor Rabbi charged with incitement [Link]
Israeli commander declares “holy war” on Palestinians [Link]
Legal opinion: Israel can cut off water, power to Gaza during conflict [Link]
Cut off power to Gaza dialysis patients, Knesset deputy speaker urges [Link]
Israeli officials call for cutting energy and food supplies to Gaza [Link]
“Don’t spare any civilian lives” - Israeli Deputy Speaker calls for killing and expelling Gazans [Link] [Link]
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Mothers of all Palestinians must be killed: Israeli MP Ayelet Shaked [Link]
Israeli academic: raping Palestinian women would deter attacks [Link] [Link]
"Note that his university did not reprimand him. They defended his comments: The purpose was to define the culture of death of the terrorist organizations. Dr Kedar illustrated in his words the bitter reality of the Middle East and the inability of a modern and law-abiding country to fight the terror of suicide bombers." [Link]
"Though it will be claimed by the usual public relations hacks that Prof. Kedar's monstrous rape/deterrent observation is "condemned by the Jewish tradition" (citing, for example, BT Kiddushin 22), there are rabbinic escape clauses which justify rape. First, the rape target must be classified as a zonah (prostitute) or a nokri (hostile alien). The supreme Ashkenazic halachic authority, Rabbi Moses Maimonides, rules that a Judaic soldier may rape this type of female POW (Yefas To'ar) when he is not actively fighting a battle (cf. Hilchos Melachim 8:3). For an explication of this subject consult my book, Judaism Discovered, p. 904.
"It is the consensus of many halakhic [rabbinic law] decisors that the yefat to’ar [non-Judaic female prisoners] can be subject to involuntary intercourse [rape], though only once, after which she must undergo a specific regimen prescribed in the Torah [i.e. Talmud], conversion and marriage, before her [Judaic] captor is permitted further sexual relations with her. (Dov S. Zakheim, "Confronting Evil: Terrorists, Torture, The Military and Halakhah," published by Yeshivat Chovevei Torah Rabbinical School)" [Link]
Israeli city council hangs banner: “Israeli soldiers we are with you! Pound their mom & come home safely to your mom” [Link] [Link]
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Israeli lawmaker’s call for genocide of Palestinians gets thousands of Facebook likes [Link]
Bloodthirsty Israeli “civilians” [Link]
Bombing of Gaza children gives me “orgasm”: Israelis celebrate slaughter on Facebook [Link]
Dermer: IDF deserves Nobel Peace Prize for ‘unimaginable restraint’ "Israeli soldiers are dying so that innocent Palestinians can live" [Link] [Link]
“Most” killed in Gaza “deserved it” even though they were children and civilians, says Israel’s Danny Ayalon [Link]
French politician asks if Palestinian children killed in Gaza are “halal meat” [Link]
Not every Palestinian is a blood thirsty, violent terrorist. Not every Israeli is a blood thirsty, violent land stealer.
Stereotypes are a bad thing.
...for once again, with your usual razor-sharp discourse and impeccable style, nailing it down for all of us:
THEY'RE AFTER OUR SOULS!
"This is the real problem of Israel for the people of the world and in particular the people of Western nations who are very much the primary target of this attempt to, essentially, subvert their souls, or at least their humanity (or what is left of it)."
"Now while he [Jesus] was in Jerusalem at the Passover Festival, many people saw the signs he was performing and believed in his name. But Jesus would not entrust himself to them, for he knew all people. He did not need any testimony about mankind, for he knew what was in each person" (John 2:23-25).
I'm not attempting to excuse the slaughter of children. That is a ridiculous allegation. I'm simply not taking your article seriously because it is full of bias and very poor reasoning.
You haven't really added much to help you point except repeat the party line over and over again. Not very convincing. Even your rebuttle to Joe's points didn't add anything to the conversation (ie, actual sources or links) to prove your point. Again not very convincing. So far all I've read was a bunch of rambling nonsense, just a tape stuck on repeat.
Are you referring to me? Someone did call me that name.
Shall I spoon feed you? I'm a firm believer that everyone needs to seek out the knowledge and information themselves. Don't take my word for it, go look it up.
Sounds to me like you may have an issue with comprehension.
Wave after wave of Jews immigrated to Palestine over the first half of the 20th century. That culminated in the ETHNIC CLEANSING of 700,000 Palestinians from their homes and land. Those that remained have been living under an Israeli-imposed Apartheid regime since then. Israel is in the process of massacring hundreds of Palestinian civilian in Gaza. And you have the effrontery to both dismiss those FACTS and justify the slaughter of civilians based on words in a work of religious fiction.
I'm not lying Joe. Check your scholarship, sources, and prejudice.
Completely untrue. There is never justification to slaughter civilians or anyone else. And I'm not basing anything I've said on religious fiction.
I can differentiate between discussing the current conflict from religious views.
niche... Men that is tight one!
"We have to protect ourselves. We try to target the rocketeers, we do. And all civilian casualties are not intended by us but actually intended by Hamas who want to pile up as many civilian dead as they can because somebody said they use telegenically dead Palestinians for the cause. They want the more dead the better." - Benjamin Netanyahu
Joe writes, "Think about that for a moment, and while you do so, consider this image of a Palestinian girl in her father's arms. Half of her head was blown off by Netanyahu's soldiers in the Shuja'iya neighborhood two days ago."
Am I the only one who notices there are 3 cameras snapping pictures of this poor little girl? Maybe Netanyahu has a point.
Notice how Palestinians have been caught faking injuries for cameras: [Link]
See how Joe reinterprets Netanyahu's comment so he can go on and attack him?
My interpretation of the comment is as follows. Netanyahu is saying Israel has to protect itself by attacking the terrorists that hide behind civilians. We don't want to have civilian casualties, but Hamas used them as human shields. They want as many civilians to be injured and killed so they can take pictures to support their cause in continuing violence against Israeli civilians and children. The more unintended casualties the better for Hamas.
So... whose interpretation is better? Joe's or Monster Bear's?
"When peace comes, we will perhaps in time be able to forgive the Arabs for killing our sons, but it will be harder for us to forgive them for having forced us to kill their sons.Peace will come when the Arabs start to love their children more than they hate us." - Golda Meir
The context of Golda Meir is concerning Arab war against Israel. My interpretation of Golda Meir is simple. The Arabs start the wars that kill our sons (soldiers), but as the aggressors they have forced us to kill their sons (soldiers). That will be harder to forgive. Peace will come when the Arabs love their children more than hating Israelis.
[Link]
What does it mean to use human shields? Employed by the Germans and Japanese in the second word war, the tactic is premised on an underlying trust in your enemy's humanity. It appeals to the compassion and mercy of the combatant that they not slaughter the innocent in order to avenge their target. The 'shield' is not the human bodies surrounding the 'guilty' party, the shield is the clemency that mankind instinctively affords the innocent. The shield evaporates only when confronted by an enemy who is not merely a fellow solder locked in a power battle, but a psychopath unconcerned with the pain of others. Such is the case with the Hamas. They are faced with an enemy who is willing to obliterate pregnant women, babies, kids, handicapped people, schools and crowded hospitals in order to smash their target. The Israelis repeatedly demonstrate a pathological disregard for any life that is not a Jewish life, and it is for this reason alone, that the Hamas are utterly incapable of ever using 'human shields.'
However, Netanyahu, pro Israeli media and Zionist supporters can't resist endlessly recycling their trope that the Hamas use civilians to guard their rockets. They are clearly flummoxed as to why this assertion does nothing to quell the snowballing international outrage at the massacres they are committing. Their argument attempts to plant in our minds the notion that the Hamas actively invite the Israeli military to slaughter and maim innocents and, in doing so, prove that their savagery deserves to be annihilated. Paradoxically therefore, according to the twisted logic of Zionists, the more innocent Palestinians that die, the worse the Palestinians are. As a collective they are guilty of being innocent.
But this propaganda ploy doesn't work. Not only does it not work, it boomerangs completely. Every time a Zionist apologist repeats their 'human shield' accusations they merely advertise their own deficit of basic humanity. They tell us 'the Hamas think we have empathy for our fellow human beings, but if you look at the casualty figures, you'll see how mistaken they are.'
The other issues at play here are the rights of the Palestinians to defend themselves and the pragmatics of warfare in a refugee camp. Israel is extremely fond of telling the world that they have the right to defend themselves. They enjoy a nuclear arsenal, cutting edge American weaponry and the formidable Iron Dome technology. Yet, although Israel constantly brags about its own egalitarian credentials, for some reason Israel refuses to grant the Palestinian people this same intrinsic right to defense that it demands for itself. Palestinians are not allowed to protect themselves. They are not allowed to fight. Instead we are invited to imagine that it is somehow acceptable for the Palestinians to have no weaponry whatsoever, no army, no solders, no rights. We are lead to believe that the only way for Palestinians to prove their integrity, is to lie down like lambs and quietly live out the unspeakably miserable lives of squalor, poverty and despair that Israel has designed for them. In short, Israel wishes the Palestinians were suicidal but, inconveniently, they keep proving to us that they are not.
Obviously asking a people to passively embrace their own ethnic cleansing is implausible. One would hope that the Jews, more than anyone, might be capable of grasping such a fundamental truth - but sadly not. Given then, that the people of Gaza, like any other human beings, have right to defense, where exactly should they store their weapons? In the rolling valleys and tumbling hills of Haraat al-Daraj? Amid the fauna-filled acres of Shuja'iyya? Gaza is home to approximately 1.8 million people, it is 25 miles long by 5 to 7 miles wide and sealed by both an Egyptian and Israeli blockade. It is the most crowded open air prison on earth. The only place to feasibly store weapons is inevitably in the proximity of the people forced to live there cheek by jowl. Israel has now ordered some 43% of the territory to be evacuated. But where to? The Kafka-esque request to insist people go, knowing there is nowhere to go to, is clearly there to benefit Israeli PR, not save lives. And it doesn't fool anyone. There are currently hundreds of thousands of displaced. The schools that have opened to receive those fleeing are already overflowing and Palestinians that endured the bombings of schools during Operation cast Lead, know that even a so called 'refuge' can not guarantee safety. Lets be clear: the only people putting the Palestinians in danger are the Israelis. The only people killing innocent people are the Israelis. The Hamas may not be the party that the chattering classes of the West would want to govern them, but they are democratically elected and they have as much right as Israel, Britain, France and America to fight against an oppressor that quite literally wants to 'wipe them off the map.' They face a tough job, but one thing they can't do is use human shields against an enemy that doesn't recognise them as human.
5 Broken cameras can now also be viewed on Zengardener.com .
what an absolutely beautiful name. really! :-))
Asino: thank joe "from all of us"??? Speak for yourself! AND.... "they re after our souls" ??? What a ridiculous thought! They re only after ego-stuffings. Sheesh !! ;-)
Daime and barbara, there exists a passage somewhere in which is stated that ‘words’ are to be used for 3 reasons only. to express something kind, or intelligent, or true.
In other words... if its worthless; it has no value.
That is not a true statement. The Israelis didn't attack Gaza because of the murder of the 3 teenagers. They attacked Gaza because Hamas started shooting rockets at Israel's civilian population.
[Link]
Israel Vows Revenge for Teenagers' Deaths
Joshua Mitnick
Wall Street Journal
June 30, 2014 7:48 p.m. ET
TEL AVIV—Israel said it found the bodies of three teenagers in the West Bank whose disappearance 2½ weeks ago triggered one of the biggest army crackdowns in the Palestinian territory in years.
Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu vowed to exact revenge on the Palestinian militant group Hamas.
A joint funeral for the three teenagers alleged to have been killed by Hamas is scheduled to take place today as the event has triggered one of the biggest army crackdowns in the Palestinian territory in years.
"We found three bodies this evening, and all the signs indicate these are bodies of the three kidnapped teenagers,'' he said Monday. "They were kidnapped and murdered in cold blood by human animals….Hamas is responsible and Hamas will pay.''
Netanyahu may vow revenge for the killing, but that doesn't mean he was going to launch an assault on Gaza. That could simply mean he was going to bring the killers to justice. If Hamas was involved, they would be held accountable as well.
You sure like to throw the word "liar" around.
"The IDF operation against Gaza, called “Tzuk Eitan” or “Protective Edge”, has commenced.
Israel Air Force planes have begun hitting targets in Gaza, following a day where some 80 Hamas terrorist rockets were launched against Israeli civilians." (News story here: http://www.jewishpress.com/news/breaking-news/idfs-operation-protective-edge-begins-against-gaza/2014/07/08/)
You seem to have a selective memory.
July 8, 2014
"Israel and Hamas escalated their military confrontation on Tuesday, with Israel carrying out extensive air attacks in response to heavy rocket fire..."
[Link]
This is one of the most ridiculous statements in Joe's essay. Every single person in the west is an accomplice in the slaughter of civilians, children included?
This is the best statement that reveals that Joe's reasoning and logic is completely flawed. SOTT is supposed to be "unbiased." Joe's essays are the completely opposite.
I'm not a religious nut (but I am a believer). That is simply your way of attacking my credibility by calling me names.
I don't sanction the murder of children.
You are biased because I don't see you writing any articles about the attack and murder of Israel civilians and children by Palestinian terrorists over the years. You blame everything on Israel. That is not unbiased.
"God promised the land to Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, and their descendants. Jacob was renamed Israel and his 12 sons produced the 12 tribes of Israel. You can look up Joel 3:2 concerning God's opinion on the land and His people Israel."
Both statements belong to monster troll, what an idiot.
"In other words... if its worthless; it has no value."
Yeah, just like your comments. You and monster bear here may do well on a pro-sionist forum. Why don't you find another place where they believe what you believe and think that God did this or that? That's proof, yeah....
Monster bear wrote:
"So... whose interpretation is better? Joe's or Monster Bear's?"
Geez, get real. You sound like a five year old.
Since you mention "biases", monster bear, geez, either you don't have a concience, or you have been sold the oldest lie in the book. Facts are facts, and yours are pretty weak to say the least. You are only exposing yourself here.
And when you look at the facts in the ground, how can one NOT be biased and feel for those children and innocent victims? Yeah, I'm biased. If I had Netanhayu in front of me right now, I don't think I'd be able to greet him cordially, to say the least. Yeah, I'm biaised and angry because people like you believe this BS and psychoapathic lies. I'm biased against criminals who blame their victims. I'm biased against politicians like psycho-Ayelet Shaked who say that palestinian women should be killed because they give birth to "little snakes". Yeah, you could call that bias, I guess.
Can you not see WHO benefits from this conflict???? Why would "Hamas", why would that father, lend himself to such a ridiculous plots to harness sympathy, when in reality, what happens is that they get bombed even worse, they lose their land, they live in a prison AND they don't have any REAL international support???? Don't you see how insane what you suggest is???? No, you don't, or you do but you are playing dumb. I don't know. But then again, I'm biased against people like you who spread lies and propaganda...
...the intensity of trolling going on, suggests that this article sure struck somebody's nerve. Is it possible to see when the trollers...er...commenters created their accounts? A thought occurred that perhaps diamond eyes is an alias of Teddy Bear....err, Monster Bear. Convenient sock puppet, or so it seems.
I do want to to say thank you to all. The rational, for calling a spade a spade. The trollers for giving a demonstration
Rf
Truly, BiblicalBear, what a cute name ;-)
Rf
One of them is tribal, and the individual identifies with the group and finds meaning through stories and myths. Mythic membership is another way to describe tribalism. It is a stage of development in the human psyche. It doesn't matter if you associate with an actual tribe (like many such cultures still do in the developing world) or an imagined tribe. It even rears it's head in politics via the political tribalism that is rampant in US politics. Belief is so strong in the tribal myth, that only the hardest facts can break it. Unfortunately, there is so much disinformation around this and a whole host of other issues, that the tribal belief prevails. If one identifies with the belief so strongly that the entire sense of self is dependent on that belief, it's like having to kill oneself to change ones mind. It's estimated that 40% of humans are at this stage of development.
James Fowler formulated a developmental hierarchy (among others who have done similar work, Abraham Maslow being probably the most famous) which he extensively explained in his "Stages of Faith: The Psychology of Human Develoment and the Quest for Meaning", which appeared in 1981.
"Fowler's Stage 2 is called the Mythic, Literal Stage. Here the child (or adult person stuck in this phase) is likely to start sorting out the real from the make-believe. Story becomes the major way of giving unity and value to experience, but the symbols in those stories are seen as one-dimensional and literal. Moreoever, beliefs, moral rules and attitudes are also held literally. Thus, God is an anthropomorphic being in the sky; heaven and hell are viewed as actual places.
The person in the second of James Fowler's Stages is also more able to take the perspective of another person but his view of reciprocity is also rather literal. "If I follow the rules, God will give me a good life." "If I pray, God will grant my wish."
A person may begin to grow out of this phase when he encounters conflicts and contradictions in the stories he is interpreting literally and begins to reflect on the real meanings."
The problem with decoding the myths upon such encounters of conflict and contradiction, as I see it, is information overload. Nobody can check and cross-check all the various sources. It is easier to just keep believing, as it takes tremendous energy, literally, for the ego to challenge it's core values so deeply. ( I recall reading somewhere on Sott about the actual brain physiology involved). Not to mention the ridicule one gets from the 40% (that's probably higher in the developed world, because much of the undeveloped world continues to be "stuck" at lower stages). So when someone begins to question their own mythic beliefs, and they look outward for confirmation (which is a habit of the mythic membership/tribal mind), they are ostracized. Imagine that at least 4 of every 10 people you know will be offended by a simple question. I am not optimistic about the chances for reconciliation.
Regarding the middle east, is there any place in the world more defined by tribalism on the political stage?
That's some serious backwardness! I mean how nuts can a guy be who walks into my house telling me to move out because thousands of years ago some weirdo allegedly promised him this house? Because otherwise he'd kill me?
It is really beyond sickening to *still* have to share the planet, and deal with such troglodyte a-holes. (Apologies to the real troglodytes).
As you say and cite, one can draw a definite parallel between the evolution of a child into an adult and elder on one side, and the evolution of civilization from childish and self-righteous to responsible, emphatic and tolerant on the other.
That tribe must have missed several trains, boats and buses in the process.
.A
[Link]
Miko Peled, an Israeli military general's son, provides truth about Israel [Link]
Miko on SOTT Talk Radio: "Israel massacres Palestinians (again): Interview with Miko Peled" [Link]
Professor Shlomo Sand on the invention of the Jewish people [Link]
The sky above me is filled with thunderbolts of rage, and the air filled with rivers of tears. Mother Earth trembles in torment and even the plant kingdom droops in sorrow. All natural creatures are stunned, frozen in shock, throughout these days.
Normal true humans FEEL what's taking place, an all-stops-out prelude to one more demonic genocide. Mothers and fathers and CHILDREN all over the planet feel the horrendousness of what the zio-demons and their zio-fundie-'christian' slave-morons are attempting to achieve, which is, as Joe alludes, to destroy our souls, with the use of their sick mythologies of unholy fake scriptures sourced in some realm of purely demonic entitie/s. These fake 'religions' are, in actuality, the ugliest psy-ops ever perpetrated on the human race.
Normal, non-psychopathic human beings are connected, both physically and metaphysically. The psychos, only physically, but only barely, with extensive armoring.
Hasbara scum like the ones trolling this thread amply expose themselves to be the narcissistic, brainwashed POS's that they are. The can spew their intellectual distortions of history endlessly, and try to pull normal people into their soul-less mental space of arguments over definitions and legalistic bullshit, but it's all mental diarrhea dredged up from a lower orifice. They are the equivalent of the israeli occupation force spraying the Palestinians' homes with raw sewage, which they have done for years, as well as poisoning the wells and orchards.
The world is sick and tired of the death cult, as SAJ rightly calls it, and all SAJ's links clearly illustrate the terminally incurable nature of the disease.
Facts roll right off the greasy backs of trolls like Monster, and nothing will change their minds, for one of two reasons. Either they know they're lying and spouting carefully crafted catch phrases, slogans, and 'talking points', in which case you're dealing with a propagandist whose aim is simply to direct readers according to a specific ideological agenda and who therefore will not concede to reason or facts; or they are so emotionally inured in their own faulty thinking that the cognitive dissonance or inferiority feelings caused by uncomfortable facts overload their circuits. They're so used to conversive thinking (blocking, subconscious selection and substitution of data) that it becomes a habitual mode of thought. It's like telling a left-handed person to write as well with their right hand. They simply can't do it.
I can't believe how you are all attacking Monster Bear! All he did was state historical facts and express concern and pity for the ongoing conflict.
If the facts don't support your view, don't get angry but start thinking. Maybe you don't know everything about the Israeli Palestinian conflict and could stand to learn a thing or two!
One thing Monster Bear said that is indisputable, the state of Israel didn't start the conflict.
And if you want to blame anybody for "stealing" Palestinian land, blame in on the UN and the Allied Nations.
The founders of the state of Israel FUNDAMENTALLY started the conflict by founding the state on land BELONGING TO ANOTHER PEOPLE AND ETHNICALLY CLEANSING THEM FROM IT. Jewish immigrants and terrorists were aided and abetted in their theft for sure by Western politicians, but since then they have perpetuated the crime and indeed, made it far worse.
Chu, get a grip!
...it would be more accurate to say he stated historical factoids.
Rf
All Hasbara trolls, please, get yourself familiar with the writings of Gilad Atzmon.
He hasn't got good news for Israel.
That no one believes Monster Bear. Didn't you notice how many times he read God's mind?!
A Stamford Hill yeshivah celebrated the festival of Lag ba’Omer on Sunday by burning giant Magen Davids in a show of anti-Zionism.….[Link]
IJAN
International Jewish Anti-Zionist network….[Link]
No use arguing with the likes of Monster Bear and his/her supporters.
Israel employs a vast army of internet bloggers to attack websites / articles that are critical of Israel:
[Link]
Too bad they walked into the wrong bar ;-)
btw Great article, Joe!
"We are doctors and scientists, who spend our lives developing means to care and protect health and lives. We are also informed people; we teach the ethics of our professions, together with the knowledge and practice of it. We all have worked in and known the situation of Gaza for years.
On the basis of our ethics and practice, we are denouncing what we witness in the aggression of Gaza by Israel.
We ask our colleagues, old and young professionals, to denounce this Israeli aggression. We challenge the perversity of a propaganda that justifies the creation of an emergency to masquerade a massacre, a so-called “defensive aggression”. In reality it is a ruthless assault of unlimited duration, extent, and intensity. We wish to report the facts as we see them and their implications on the lives of the people.
We are appalled by the military onslaught on civilians in Gaza under the guise of punishing terrorists. This is the third large scale military assault on Gaza since 2008. Each time the death toll is borne mainly by innocent people in Gaza, especially women and children under the unacceptable pretext of Israel eradicating political parties and resistance to the occupation and siege they impose.
This action also terrifies those who are not directly hit, and wounds the soul, mind, and resilience of the young generation. Our condemnation and disgust are further compounded by the denial and prohibition for Gaza to receive external help and supplies to alleviate the dire circumstances. [...]"
[Link]
@Joe You wrote, "He didn't state historical facts. He distorted history and told bare faced lies that are easily proven as such. We will not tolerate lies and apologies for mass murder on this site."
I'm not distorting history, nor am I telling bare faced lies. You have dis-proven anything I've said. You way of not tolerating people is to silence/mute them so they can't comment. The idea of free thinking and freedom of speech is not something this site embraces.
I have not been rude, called people names, been malicious, nor anything else inappropriate. I've challenged you and other readers opinions and for that the Monster Bear account was muted, and I was unable to continue responding.
People call for toleration of folks across the spectrum, but when it comes down to it you and others on SOTT are closed minded and intolerant to other people's views on this subject.
@Divide By Zero You wrote, "A few years as a reader, Yet you just signed up on the 23rd of July? ...you didn't have a problem with what SOTT wrote about the Israeli psychopathic actions before, and just decided to sign up now?"
I have been reading SOTT for a few years now, and I have never bothered to sign up to make comments etc. I did have a problem with essays on Israel, but I never bothered to make comments. Why? Because of the exact response my input has caused.
I've been called names, attacked personally, and muted/silenced from making comments. This has been an exercise in futility.
@ Joe You wrote, "...You're sick, both of you, neither of your deserve an ounce of respect. You deserve condemnation."
Just because we have a different opinion from yours doesn't mean we should be disrespected and condemned. Do you want to pull the trigger yourself Joe?
We are not cheer leading the destruction on Gaza and death of children. I hate violence and grieve for the children and others who are suffering.
You wrote, "Now you're just nitpicking to try and score points because you've been outed as a religious nut who sanctions the murder of children on the basis of your religious belief. That's pretty pathetic."
A religious nut? You are a bigot. The definition of a bigot is, "A person who strongly and unfairly dislikes other people, ideas, etc A person who hates or refuses to accept the members of a particular group (such as a racial or religious group)."
You obviously dislikes people with religious faith and Jews.
@un chien anadolu You wrote, "Both statements belong to monster troll, what an idiot."
Being a religious nut and being a person of faith are two different things. It is sad that you can't understand that distinction.
@Chu"Why would "Hamas", why would that father, lend himself to such a ridiculous plots to harness sympathy..."
The Palestinians have been caught faking pictures and video to gain sympathy through lies and manipulation in the past. The little girl in Joe's picture above could be injured or she may not. I think it is suspicious that there are at least 3 cameras in that picture. It is terrible to fake things like that, and I personally don't like being manipulated into supporting a violent, evil group like Hamas.
Go look up the term Pallywood and you will find plenty of proof.
Again, I grieve for the children who are suffering and have died in this conflict. It is a terrible tragedy. I have compassion and sympathy for them. I don't want them to have to go through this pain.
@ Joe You wrote, "And everybody KNOWS Bibi is a vessel for the word of Yahweh, so it MUST be true!"
What a ridiculous statement. It puts your bigotry on display.
@ rflctnofu You wrote, "A thought occurred that perhaps diamond eyes is an alias of Teddy Bear....err, Monster Bear. Convenient sock puppet, or so it seems."
No. Diamond Eyes is not an alias or 2nd account of mine. There are many other people who don't agree with Joe's interpretation of the situation in Israel and Gaza.
@ hkoehli You write, "Monster Bear = Monster Troll. Monster troll make Hasbara happy"
I'm not being a troll. It was not my intent to make people mad or upset. I was simply trying to convey my view point in a respectful, thoughtful way.I don't even know what Hasbara means.
@bholanath You wrote, "Hasbara scum like the ones trolling this thread amply expose themselves to be the narcissistic, brainwashed POS's that they are. The can spew their intellectual distortions of history endlessly, and try to pull normal people into their soul-less mental space of arguments over definitions and legalistic bullshit, but it's all mental diarrhea dredged up from a lower orifice."
I'm not Hasbara. Calling somone a narcissist is an exercise in name calling that doesn't validate your viewpoint. I'm not brainwashed as I have carefully studied this subject for many years, and I have legitimately looked at serveral viewpoints on both sides. I haven't distorted history, and I have tried to understand it accurately.
Your descriptive metaphor doesn't support your points.
@hkoehli You wrote, "Facts roll right off the greasy backs of trolls like Monster, and nothing will change their minds..."
I'm not a troll, and as humans we all have greasy backs. The human body produces a natural oil if you weren't aware.
I can have my mind changed with evidence, and I have had to change my position at different times in my life because I was presented with the data and proper interpretation.
I question everything and everyone. I'm not going to just read Joe's essay and agree with it because he obviously displays a huge discrepancy in logic and reasoning.
@ B_Pilgrim Thank you for your supportive words. I'm glad there are a couple of people who understand.
@Joe You wrote, "He didn't state historical facts. He distorted history and told bare faced lies that are easily proven as such."
That is your opinion. I haven't distorted history nor told lies. You have not proven anything I have said to be in error. Your continued claim is easily dismissed by reasonable people. But, your tool in this debate is to mute/silence me so I can't continue the discussion.
@pinkfreud You wrote, "That no one believes Monster Bear. Didn't you notice how many times he read God's mind?!"
I never claimed to read God's mind. What a silly allegation.
Now... Let's lay out what we do agree on.
1) We all agree that the injury and death of innocent civilians and children is a horrible occurrence. I for one am very grieved over all the suffering.
2) We seem to all have compassion for the Palestinians, and we agree that they should have an independent state so they can live in peace and prosperity.
Questions
A) Can we agree that Israel should have an independent state so they can also live in peace and prosperity?
B) Can those who have been arguing against me please condemn in the strongest terms that Palestinian violence and aggression against Israel is wrong and should be stopped?
C) Can those who have been arguing against me please tell me that the attacks on Israel's innocent civilians and children is just as evil and reprehensible as what has happened on the Palestinian side?
D) Can we agree that Israelis have a right to live in the land along side the Arabs as they have lived in the land for thousands of years as well?
E) Isn't it right for Israelis' descendants who were forcibly taken out of the land by the Romans to return and live there?
To reply to only a few of you "points:"
You said "I personally don't like being manipulated into supporting a violent, evil group like Hamas." And I don't like being manipulated to support an evil, psychopathic, murderous state such as Israel. I would complain about wanton killing of unarmed, defenseless and helpless people in Israel, but there hasn't been much of that so this is just a distraction from what's actually happening now (and has been happening over and over) to the Palestinians. And much of the violence against Israelis have been false flag operations carried out by Israeli intelligence, including the kidnapping and killing of the three teenagers - all of it very well documented. That's how sick, perverted, and pathological Israeli policies are. But if you really WERE open minded (and empathetic) you'd already know that.
IF the roles were reversed, and Jews were trapped in the tiny space of Gaza being butchered (and generally kept in abominable conditions), I'd be condemning it in the strongest terms. But, again, that is not what is happening and is a distraction from what IS happening.
You say you haven't distorted history. You have, but not only you, all of official history is fabricated and distorted - has been for thousands of years because of the psychopathic elite in all areas of human life.
Do you not see your contradictions? But for one, you stated your reasons for not signing up and posting comments here for years (supposedly). But now you persist and even sign up for a new account to continue making noise and manipulating and making mealy mouth excuses for unacceptable actions no matter to whom they are being done. See?
"A) Can we agree that Israel should have an independent state so they can also live in peace and prosperity?"
Sure, but not on anyone else's land. It's a pretty simple matter of INTERNATIONAL LAW.
"B) Can those who have been arguing against me please condemn in the strongest terms that Palestinian violence and aggression against Israel is wrong and should be stopped?"
No, resistance against oppression and occupation is permitted under the Geneva Conventions. Stealing someone else's land is NOT.
"C) Can those who have been arguing against me please tell me that the attacks on Israel's innocent civilians and children is just as evil and reprehensible as what has happened on the Palestinian side?"
No, because there is a small matter of proportionality and the number of people killed. I trust I don't have to give you the numbers.
"D) Can we agree that Israelis have a right to live in the land along side the Arabs as they have lived in the land for thousands of years as well?"
No, because Israelis have not lived in the land for thousands of years. That is a myth. A few small communities of Jews lived there, but they never aspired to a nation state. That was only created by mass immigration from elsewhere. Israelis are illegal colonists in the Middle East.
"E) Isn't it right for Israelis' descendants who were forcibly taken out of the land by the Romans to return and live there?"
Give up the biblical BS as 'history'. There is no historical evidence for any of your biblical narratives that you use to justify the slaughter of Palestinians.
Please forgive my typos.
Nurse!!!
Heyyyy nice to have you back ;-)
Funny..... I did think you had a dr's appointment biblicbear (what an absolutely gorgeous name :))))
You go doc!!
Really.... in my years of presense here I ve never ever wasted my time reading any his stuff cause I just cant get over his dispicable (and others' ) trigger-happy violent behaviour towards one another.... and I could be on the way out again, as so many other critical sott thinkers/speakers have sadly gone ;-)
I refrain from commenting too for same reasons until the comments scream for a little tlc, et voilà!
This explains nicely their challenge.... and keep in mind; not all people are HUMAN!
[Link]
AS noted somewhere else here on sott this morning:
t's better to be quiet and thaught a fool, than to open your mouth and remove all doubt.
Decrying "Brutal Operation Taking Place In Our Name," Israeli Military Reservists Refuse to Serve
As Israel pledges to continue the assault on Gaza for "as long as is required," we are joined by two Israelis who have refused to serve in their country’s military reserves.
On Tuesday, the Washington Post ran an open letter authored by Yael Even Or titled, "We are Israeli reservists. We refuse to serve," announcing that more than 50 former Israeli soldiers have signed a petition declaring their refusal to be part of the Israeli military reserves.
"This petition, long in the making, has a special urgency because of the brutal military operation now taking place in our name," Even Or writes. An Israeli journalist and activist who evaluated candidates for the Israeli army’s recruitment department during her service, Even Or is now a graduate student in International Affairs at The New School in New York City. She join us to discuss the reservists’ letter. We are also joined from Tel Aviv by Yonatan Shapira, a former Israeli captain and air force pilot, who in 2003 spearheaded a letter signed by 27 Israeli pilots who refused to participate in military operations against Palestinians.
"This video was posted on the Facebook page of Tzinur Layla, a program of Israel’s Channel 10 that sources material from social media.
It shows members of the Breslauer Hassidim, a mystical Jewish sect, dancing and singing “Le’hiyot be simcha tamid” (“Always be joyful”) with Israeli soldiers manning an artillery battery.
The Breslauer Hassidim, a sect that typically attracts young men, affix stickers to artillery shells that may be about to be fired into the Gaza Strip.
The stickers carry the phrase “na nach nachma nachman me’uman,” the mystical utterance that refers to the name of their spiritual founder, the eighteenth century Rabbi Nachman of Breslov.
The group explains that uttering the phrase “eases all the troubles and sweetens all the harsh judgements, all the sins and all the falls and all of the heresy of the world” and transforms everything “to good.”
They also say that the incantation “is enough to destroy the Other Side (the Evil Inclination).” This is a reference to taming their sexual libido, Israel expert Dena Shunra told The Electronic Intifada." [Link]
Mission Accomplished–’Wartime unity conceals political differences among American Jews’ [Link]
the quantity of responses, vitriolic and otherwise, which the topic raises as compared to other posted articles. Wonder what THAT is all about?
[Link]
The state of Israel and its leaders should be held accountable for their crimes against humanity.
but I enjoyed the posts more (honestly I cant say I enjoyed the article because that would be gross but you know what I mean) . It's all good too see, even the trolls. We all have 'trolls' in our lives, this set of posts gives hope to me and it should give hope to others. Stay strong, don't waiver, don't relent!!! Truth is truth and I am happy to see Joe and others stand up for the truth, relentlessly at that. We should all be so thorough. Good job for all those who hate to see the innocent suffer and who did their part to squash the trolls. I hope this type of trolling isn't a regular thing here but if so lets give em hell.
Diamond eyes has been sending nasty emails to Sott.net because Sott.net decided that her/his friend "Monster Bear" needed to be facilitated to stop posting so much repetitive nonsense by being prevented from posting because he couldn't stop him himself.
Here is her/his latest:
"On 25/07/2014 03:25, Laika laikas wrote:
Well joe... youre a regular american dirtbag of an arspick.
GRAND SLAM COWARD..... WATCH the sword ;-)
Knowing that you were brought up thru violence and that is all you are capable of.
Youre garage [sic]... and I ll get back in scumbag ;-)"
Strange. All I did was point out the MB was lying and that he and DiamondEyes were excusing the murder of children and should be condemned for doing so. For that I get called garage?!
Looks like the rage and hatred was all projection on diamond eyes' part - proven by diamond eyes' own email.
Just like their pathological persistence to impose their excusing of the most egregious crimes against humanity, they insist on being able to do what they want on YOUR website, you know, free speech and all that jazz.
"WATCH the sword"? with a winkie after it? WTF is that even supposed to mean??
Meltdown.
Notice how their counter is always the same: oh, Hamas is firing rockets - hmmm, their puny homemade rockets and slingshots. Of course not acknowledged is that by protecting the little scraps the Palestinians have left, they must answer to Israeli flechette projectiles, bunker busters and phosphorus rain. If more is needed, in come the tanks, flamethrowers if need be, and much more of the most sufficient killing weaponry money can buy (especially if it is give by the U.S.), however, dead is dead and they have great hate clouding their minds. Notwithstanding that, and just to prove how ballsy they realy are - Iran, are you listening; they've got those nice little pesky atomic weapons hidden in their underground bunkers to make demands with and put the fear of their god into humankind - fundies love this part.
When the msm steps out of line, it is no trouble to reel them back in. When a U.S. congressman has to answer to his angry constituents, APAC will be there to remind. When social media needs some tweaking, such as on SoTT this day, their little army of RWA's will plug away, and when they need help with difficult rebuttals, they will bring in their supervisors to help craft their biblical propaganda and historizised version of their warped internal and external worldview.
Here are the results of Israel's recent pathological handy work (it gets worse):
P.S. MB/D-eyes, try and remember a few of these names if you can and why they died.
Tuesday, July 8:
1. Mohammed Sha’aban, 24, was killed in a bombing of his car in Gaza City.
2. Ahmad Sha’aban, 30, died in the same bombing.
3. Khadir al-Bashiliki, 45, died in the same bombing.
4. Rashad Yaseen, 27, was killed in a bombing of the Nusseirat refugee camp in central Gaza.
5. Riad Mohammed Kawareh, 50, was killed in a bombing of his family’s home in Khan Younis.
6. Seraj Ayad Abed al-A’al, 8, was wounded in the same bombing and succumbed to his injuries on Tuesday evening.
7. Mohammed Ayman Ashour, 15, died in the same bombing.
8. Bakr Mohammed Joudah, 22, died in the same bombing.
9. Ammar Mohammed Joudah, 26, died in the same bombing.
10. Hussein Yousef Kawareh, 13, died in the same bombing.
11. Mohammed Ibrahim Kawareh, 50, died in the same bombing.
12. Bassim Salim Kawareh, 10, died in the same bombing.
13. Mousa Habib, 16, from Gaza City’s al-Shujaiyah neighborhood, was killed along with his 22-year old cousin while the pair were riding a motorcycle.
14. Mohammed Habib, 22, was killed with Mousa Habib.
15. Sakr Aysh al-Ajouri, 22, was killed in an attack on Jabaliyah, in northern Gaza.
16. Ahmad Na’el Mehdi, 16, from Gaza City’s Sheikh Radwan neighborhood, was killed in a bombing that wounded two of his friends.
17. Hafiz Mohammed Hamad, 30, an Islamic Jihad commander, was killed in the bombing of his home in Beit Hanoun, along with five of his family members.
18. Ibrahim Mohammed Hamad, 26, died in the same bombing.
19. Mehdi Mohammed Hamad, 46, died in the same bombing.
20. Fawzia Khalil Hamad, 62, died in the same bombing.
21. Dunia Mehdi Hamad, 16, died in the same bombing.
22. Suha Hamad, 25, died in the same bombing.
23. Suleiman Salman Abu Soaween, 22
Wednesday, July 9:
24. Abdelhadi Jamaat al-Sufi, 24, was killed in a bombing near the Rafah crossing.
25. Naifeh Farjallah, 80, was killed in an airstrike on the town of Moghraqa, southwest of Gaza City.
26. Abdelnasser Abu Kweek, 60, was killed in the bombing of Gaza’s central governorate along with his son.
27. Khaled Abu Kweek, 31, Abdelnasser Abu Kweek’s son, was killed in the same bombing.
28. Amir Areef, 13, died in a bombing in Sha’af.
29. Mohammed Malkiyeh, one and a half years old, died in a bombing along with his mother and a young man.
30. Amniyeh Malkiyeh, 27, Mohammed Malkiyeh’s mother, died in the same bombing.
31. Hatem Abu Salem, 28, died in the same bombing.
32. Mohammed Khaled al-Nimri, 22
33. Sahar Hamdan, 40, died in the bombing of her home in Beit Hanoun.
34. Ibrahim Masri, 14, Sahar Hamdan’s son, was killed in the same bombing.
35. Sumoud al-Nawasra, a mother, was killed in a bombing along with her two children.
36. Mohammed Khalaf al-Nawasra, 4, arrived at the hospital “in shreds.”
37. Nidal Khalaf al-Nawasra, a child of unreported age, died along with Mohammed and Sumoud.
38. Salah Awwad al-Nawasra, was killed in the same bombing. His body was found under the rubble of the house.
39. Aisha Nijm
40. Amal Youssef Abdel Ghafour
41. Ranim Jawde Abdel Ghafour, a young girl
42. Rashid al-Kafarneh, 30, was killed when the motorcycle he was riding was bombed.
43. Ibrahim Daoud al-Balawi, 24
44. Abdelrahman Jamal al-Zamli, 22
45. Ibrahim Ahmad Abideen, 42
46. Mustafa Abu Mar, 20
47. Khalid Abu Mar, 23
48. Mazen Farj al-Jarbah, 30
49. Marwan Slim, 27
50. Hani Saleh Hamad, 57, was killed in a bombing in Beit Hanoun along with his son Ibrahim.
51. Ibrahim Hamad, 20, was killed in the same bombing.
52. Salima Hassan Musallim al-Arja, 60, was killed in a bombing in Rafah that wounded five others.
53. Maryam Atieh Muhammad al-Arja, 11, was killed in the same bombing.
54. Hamad Shahab, 27
55. Ibrahim Khalil Qanun, 24, was killed in a bombing of Khan Younis.
56. Muhammad Khalil Qanun, 26, was killed in the same attack.
57. Hamdi Badieh Sawali, 33, was killed in the same attack.
58. Ahmad Sawali, 28, was killed in the same attack.
59. Suleiman al-Astal, 55
60. Muhammad al-Aqqad, 24
61. Ra'ed Shalat, 37, was killed in a bombing that wounded 6 others.
Thursday, July 10:
62. Asma Mahmoud al-Hajj was killed in a bombing in Khan Younis that killed eight members of the same family and wounded 16 other people.
63. Basmah Abdelfattah al-Hajj, 57, was wounded in the bombing and succumbed to her injuries shortly afterwards.
64. Mahmoud Lutfi al-Hajj, 58, died in the same bombing.
65. Tarek Sa'ad al-Hajj died in the same bombing.
66. Sa'ad Mahmoud al-Hajj died in the same bombing.
67. Najla Mahmoud al-Hajj died in the same bombing.
68. Fatima al-Hajj died in the same bombing.
69. Omar al-Hajj died in the same bombing.
70. Ahmad Salim al-Astal was killed in the bombing of a beach house in Khan Younis that critically wounded more than 15 people.
71. Mousa Mohammed was killed in the same bombing. The two bodies were recovered four hours after the bombing.
72. Ra'ed al-Zawareh, 33, succumbed to his wounds and died. The location of his death was unreported.
73. Baha' Abu al-Leel, 35
74. Salim Qandil, 27, was killed in a bombing.
75. Omar al-Fyumi, 30, was killed in the same bombing.
76. Abdullah Ramadan Abu Ghazzal, 5, was killed in a bombing in Beit Lahiya.
77. Ismail Hassan Abu Jamah, 19, was killed in a bombing of Khan Younis that injured two children, one critically.
78. Unknown
79. Mahmoud Wulud was killed in a bombing of a civilian vehicle in northern Gaza. His remains were taken to Kamal Adwan Hospital in Jabaliya.
80. Hazem Balousha was killed in the same bombing. His remains are at Kamal Adwan Hospital.
81. Alaa Abdelnabi was killed in the same bombing. His remains are at Kamal Adwan Hospital.
What we are witnessing is the mass murder of an innocent people and that is the truth, anyone with eyes to see can bear witness to that fact.
Yasser Arafat fought for almost all of his adult life to try bring to the recognition of the world the plight of the Palestinian people and recognition that Palestine is a Sovereign nation, well he died in very questionable circumstances, just like any other political leader throughout the world that has attempted to stand up for the rights and freedom of the people that elect them, the plebs - you and me.
History is littered with examples, but we don't hear about them because they were demonized and assassinated. What is that age old saying to the victor are the spoils and history is written by the victor or something like that. Really! the victors are the ones that can survive and inform there grandchildren that the world was taken over by an interspecies predator and they lived to tell the tale, reminds me of the Trojan War.
As for the Lords of Entropy, that mask of sanity is dropping, notice all the propaganda that is flying fast and furious. They are becoming desperate, they are afraid of the fury of we the people.
Thank goodness for all the people that stand up in peaceful protest to educate the masses, thank goodness for all the Rabbi's that decry the Zionist state of Israel. It' only through the mass power of people speaking with a unified voice that change can be achieved
[Link]
----- "the Palestinians are MAKING us kill them" -----
For an empathic human being the pathology of this expression is beyond comprehension.
I did reflect about this sentence a bit and it came to me - this is probably what the psychopaths really experience when confronted with a human soul; it must be like looking into a mirror and being forced to see the abysmal ugliness of their own 'non-being'; their own reflection they are powerless to withstand. Hence ever-recurring, fathomless hatred of everything, a black demonic hatred of life, a desire for cruelty, a lust for murder.
The sheer insanity of a beast in convulsions is what we witness.
With respect to the bunch of the invasive trolls I'd underline:
_they_ are our puppets, not the other way around.
It's an opportunity we must use to our full advantage to entrain
ourselves to identify them as such and switch them off asap.
---------------------------------------- -
A VERY MOVING article, Joe ! Thanks for your tireless efforts
to bring this important issue up again and for the excellent research!
That these people come to a site that is anti war and start beating their war drums. That is what I call chutzpah!
Their chutzpah inevitably gets their asses kicked.
Metaphorically speaking of course.
They also invariably get outed, because compassionate people with a soul and conscience, both of which they lack, will not tolerate their specious intellectual arguments for murdering children and other defenceless Palestinians.
Yep, your article really brought out the vermin Joe, where we can see them and refute their bullshit.
Good work.
a couple of live ones here!
Christian Zionist types seem to be the worst. IDF-supporting Israelis probably avoid SOTT like the plague. I imagine we're on the Hasbara 'DO NOT ENGAGE WITH THESE WEBSITES' list
But those Israel-first true believer types actually think they can come here and 'save' us. 'In Jesus name', of course.
What I find both fascinating and revealing is that Laura posted a detailed, well documented and thoughtful comment a long way back, and both our resident shills totally ignored it. No mention whatever!.
Why would that be I wonder?
Good job cleaning out the dissenters, now you can all sit around agreeing that you should hate Israel with no pesky interruptions. It's hard to really get seriously deep into a hate kick with so many "distractions".
I have plenty of arguments and questions about the views espoused in the original article, but reading the commentary up to this point has made me realize any such discussion would be absolutely pointless, so I won't bother.
But I find the attitudes here so atrocious that I felt I should speak up, if only to condemn same. I have, and now I'm leaving. You're free to go back to getting your hate on.
Reply all you want, I won't answer. I'll be too busy eating babies and gloating over dead children, or whatever it is you people think anyone who disagrees with you does.
Well, it seems that people who expose psychopaths and their authoritarian followers and/or dupes really are at war with these people on a very fundamental level.
Kind of like a battle for their souls (maybe their own, maybe other peoples as well in a certain manner). The people they are at war with don't care about souls, probably because they don't have one or they have what looks like very stunted ones.
People like that don't value truth, honour or evidence.
I find it interesting how predictable troll attacks are. First a seemingly "reasonable" troll (monster bear) attacks the article with unsubstantiated "common sense" arguments. They ignore all attempts at reasonable discussion or exchange of information and aggressively attack the author and anyone who supports them with a mountains of word salad, refusing to back down or offer any sources to back up their arguments. When they start to look bad a foul-mouthed, largely nonsensical supporter/sock puppet (diamond eyes) or two magically appear to cheer them on and mount even more aggressive attacks. The original troll gets banned, inevitably returns with a new handle to the delight of the sock puppet, but eventually they give up (or get banned again?) when the other commenters refuse to back down. I've seen this pattern in the comments of several other articles, but I can't remember them now to link to.
Ok, so I''m stumped by this stupidity and didn't know where else to post. Perhaps we can collectively get some perspective? I'm not sure, but here I go. Recently I received a Hotmail email from an account purporting to be "brothers of Dalal Mughrabi".
The heading of the email had 'Israel must be wiped off the map', which I thought was really, really stupid, because they are quite capable of doing that to themselves and don't need any help with that from anyone else. And the text of the message was in Hebrew, so I couldn't read it. I've deleted it, so don't ask for a copy.
Did Dalal even have brothers? Who knows!
[Link]
According to the history, there are 'problems' with who actually killed the 38 Israelis (13 of whom were children). The Israelis said it was Dalal's grenade and the Palestinians say it was an Israeli helicopter gunship that didn't take too well to a Palestinian flag being raised. Well, they wouldn't would they?
When I looked at a google of those so called 'Brothers' I found a bunch of hacked Israeli websites that looked perfectly innocuous. And me, being me, thought to myself, why don't you go after some of the 'top dogs' you bunch of wimpos? (or words to that effect). You are hurting genuine good Israeli people. So of course.... I smell a rat plague. That's just me.
Has anyone else had any 'emails' (and they could be dangerous - so handle with care) from Israel 'wipers' who purport to be something they are potentially not?
Seems like Israeli Department manufacture terror in action